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Ever wish you had gone a totally different direction musically?


Lockbody

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Today, the wife was at work and my daughter was at her friends house, so it's a good time to crank up the ol' guitar amp and record some of my parts for our latest songs that I haven't got around to doing yet. Except... I don't want to. In fact, playing guitar these days is more of a chore than it is a pleasure. It doesn't help that, though I've been playing since  was fourteen, I'm not really a natural at it, and I really have to work to get an acceptable track laid down, multiple takes, punches, etc. Even playing live doesn't provide the release that it once did. I'm not much of a songwriter, either, with most of my creative output peaking in my 30s (I'm 52 now).

What I'm really enjoying, however, is the recording aspect of it. I've been recording my, and other, bands in some form since the mid-eighties, and while some of the early stuff is pretty laughable, some of it ain't bad. I love it all, from mic placement to final mix down, and have probably spent waaaaaay too much money on plugins recently.

So now I think, what if I hadn't bought and traded all these guitars and amps that I have over the years and instead bought and upgraded my recording equipment? I've got some okay stuff now, but I'm really wanting some better preamps and microphones. Warm Audio has a nice API-style 4ch preamp that I want, I wouldn't mind a couple of channels of a Neve-style preamp, or maybe a Focusrite ISA Two, and I want a stereo pair of some decent ribbon mics and an AKG-414 pair, plus I'd love to upgrade my old Event monitors, too. Too bad I've got no money to spend right now.

And the thing is, I'm down to four guitars and only two amps, and all are completely different. A Newport, Jazzmaster, parts-o-caster,  SG Classic and my Mesa Lonestar Special and Boogie Mk IV. All are exceptional (IMO) at what they do, and there's no real overlap. Only the two best and most unique sounding, the Newport and the Jazzmaster, would make a dent in that wish list above. If they even sold at all. I'd have to quit this band before I could sell the LSS, and I'm not sure I could bring myself to sell the MK IV. What kind of studio doesn't have some studio amps anyway?

I guess the biggest thing keeping me from quitting playing and selling it all is... who the hell am I going to record? Everybody and their brother has some sort of recording setup these days. I have a couple of friends trying to make in the recording business, and it ain't pretty.

Whew! Sorry about all of that! I guess that's enough recording for the day, though. I did get three songs down out of the five I needed. Time for a drink.

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No. I am thrilled it went the direction it did.

 

That said I am huge into recording these days too. It is so much fun. I have a couple friends trying to make a living at it, and you are spot on...it’s ugly out there. One of them is a master with mad skills too.I hope to start recording some other bands soon and just this week I think I scored a couple gigs...if so, I’ll use the money to buy a new mic. I need a U67 clone. 

‘I have a decent mic locker,  but yowza, recording equipment is expensive....

I will be selling my Mesa TA15, which ironically is an incredible recording amp, to help fund the mic. I have a nice Neve style preamp and need to pick up an API style too.

I am amp-heavy, so that is logical ...the Mesa is awesome, so it will sell.

From the moment I started playing guitar, I wanted to write and record originals....so thrilled to be recording now and actually generating albums. 

‘Bucket list stuff for me.

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Be a happy person. Some many people out there don’t have the level of enjoyment you have. Never will. Take a rest and let things settle for a while. Do something different in between. Things need their time. Works best for me mostly. Afterwards I think it worked out better than expected from the beginning.

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I took a big step back from playing after I reached the “our record got a good review in Rolling Stone and I hate the music business” level. Focused on fitness and bike racing. Then I rediscovered music. 

Fooling around with new instruments helps. I am a terrible keyboardist too. It gives you new perspective. 

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For me it's always been too sides of the same coin.

I've always recorded my music. I love playing and I love recording.  Even when I had nothing to really record with, I would use a cheap Radio Shack mic and two cassette decks. Record the left channel.  Playback and record on the right channel on a second tape.  Keep recording over until the hiss got too much to deal with.

Slow progression to better mics, mixing boards and recording decks.  I recorded just about every jam session we did in the period of 1979 till about 1986 when we finally stopped playing regularly.

Fast forward 10 years to getting my first amiga and starting to make "digital" music OctaMED SoundStudio then moving on to Deluxe Music, Dr T's and Bars and Pipes. When I learned I could create drum tracks to jam with I was off and running.

Later transitioning to Mac and getting garageband the the first version of Ik's Amplitube software and I was back into music, recording, and breaking out my basses and guitars slowly building up my virtual sound studio.  Now I have hundreds of virtual amps and effects, rack and studio emulations.  Some decent mics, keyboards, and a cheap digital drum set.  Everything I need.  Man I wish I could have had some of this stuff when I was younger.  I sometimes wish I would have done more in the recording, mixing and mastering when I was younger. But no real regrets.

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In my music listening habits I mostly followed the interesting and powerful drummers, though I never developed an interest to play drums. Instead I played guitar. But somehow I ticked differently than my fellow musicians of my age. I was interested in older 60's/70's stuff, while the others were into the then-modern stuff, Van Halen/Malmsteen/other metal, but mostly metal. Later in the 90's I developed a great interest in recording, but somehow people didn't show great interest in what I did and the recording process altogether. What I missed was a kick in the ass to keep up with the work. In 2000 I did the biggest change so far, being a bassplayer. In 2007 I was able to get myself into decent digital recording (at first Logic when it was still Windows-based, then on Cubase). But somehow I recently have become a bit disillusioned with the music I do, I'd love to get into keyboard playing, I always loved Piano and organ and vintage keyboards as Mellotron,  Rhodes and clavinet. The problem again is that I am completely on my own, nobody would encourage me to do things. Even playing with former fellow bandmates is no fun anymore, as interests and playstyles drifted apart over the years. Maybe I am depressed too much to enjoy the things that used to be fun.

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6 hours ago, mathman said:

I’ve always recorded my music. I love playing and I love recording.

I’d love to do it in that straight way. Instead I tend to think things through before and miss to put ideas down. In addition, I’m to much of a perfectionist. I won’t bother since I have reached much more of what I thought I would years ago.

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Do you know anyone who is maybe a singer/songwriter or solo performer you could record?  Ask someone in the band if they have any songs laying around they'd like to record.  Put up an ad at the local music store.  Start out giving people a free hour when they book one as a draw.  Just stuff off the top of my head. 

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My only regret is that I didn’t take learning theory more seriously when I was a kid first getting into guitar. I play by ear entirely, and it’s nearly impossible at my age and playing abilities to go back and learn the meat and potatoes of music... I just don’t have the patience for it now. 

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On 2/17/2018 at 8:22 PM, Jakeboy said:

That said I am huge into recording these days too. It is so much fun. I have a couple friends trying to make a living at it, and you are spot on...it’s ugly out there. One of them is a master with mad skills too.I hope to start recording some other bands soon and just this week I think I scored a couple gigs...if so, I’ll use the money to buy a new mic. I need a U67 clone. 

‘I have a decent mic locker,  but yowza, recording equipment is expensive....

I will be selling my Mesa TA15, which ironically is an incredible recording amp, to help fund the mic. I have a nice Neve style preamp and need to pick up an API style too.

One of my friends has the only 2" 24 track machine outside of the larger commercial studios and still has a hard time bringing in anyone to record. Dude makes good recordings, so that tempers me from really outlaying money on more equipment, but...

3y, no interested at Sweetwater on that WA-412 I've been looking at. That might be hard to resist today.

My Mk IV serves as our other guitarist's amp when he practices at my house. He's got his own amp, and I don't see myself joining another band where I really need the rawk that amp can bring, so I should sell it. Then I use it to record some tic tac bass, or some surf-y baritone, and I marvel at the sheer versatility of that amp and forget I thought about selling it.

 

On 2/18/2018 at 3:52 AM, gorch said:

Be a happy person. Some many people out there don’t have the level of enjoyment you have. Never will. Take a rest and let things settle for a while. Do something different in between. Things need their time. Works best for me mostly. Afterwards I think it worked out better than expected from the beginning.

 

On 2/18/2018 at 6:40 AM, polara said:

I took a big step back from playing after I reached the “our record got a good review in Rolling Stone and I hate the music business” level. Focused on fitness and bike racing. Then I rediscovered music. 

Fooling around with new instruments helps. I am a terrible keyboardist too. It gives you new perspective. 

Hard to argue with any of that. I think my rest will come when we start mixing down all the songs we've recorded over the last few months.

 

23 hours ago, Hamer_SS_guy said:

In my music listening habits I mostly followed the interesting and powerful drummers, though I never developed an interest to play drums. Instead I played guitar. But somehow I ticked differently than my fellow musicians of my age. I was interested in older 60's/70's stuff, while the others were into the then-modern stuff, Van Halen/Malmsteen/other metal, but mostly metal. Later in the 90's I developed a great interest in recording, but somehow people didn't show great interest in what I did and the recording process altogether. What I missed was a kick in the ass to keep up with the work. In 2000 I did the biggest change so far, being a bassplayer. In 2007 I was able to get myself into decent digital recording (at first Logic when it was still Windows-based, then on Cubase). But somehow I recently have become a bit disillusioned with the music I do, I'd love to get into keyboard playing, I always loved Piano and organ and vintage keyboards as Mellotron,  Rhodes and clavinet. The problem again is that I am completely on my own, nobody would encourage me to do things. Even playing with former fellow bandmates is no fun anymore, as interests and playstyles drifted apart over the years. Maybe I am depressed too much to enjoy the things that used to be fun.

I think part of my recent doldrums is that, while the cover band I'm in now is fun and all, it's not the music I would have decided to play on my own. Me? Give me a band doing Stooges, Bad Brains, and Motorhead covers and I'd probably be a lot happier. Probably wouldn't make any money doing it, but it sure would be fun.

That misses the overall point I was trying to make, though. I think back when I had my Carvin board and 8-track, instead of investing in more guitar gear at the time, which is what I did, I had moved to recording full-time. I'm probably not the only person on here to drop some decent coin on guitars and amps over the years. Knowing that I wasn't a guitarist who had "it", that money may have paid off a lot better for me if I had continued with something that I kind of knew I wanted to pursue more, but felt for some reason I needed to buy more and better guitars and amps.

 

20 hours ago, Willie G. Moseley said:

Sometimes I ponder how things would have turned out if I'd gone in the direction of beatnik/hootenanny music.

Seeing as Widespread Panic just did two nights at the Coliseum, I'd say you'd probably be pretty well off.

 

10 hours ago, scottcald said:

Do you know anyone who is maybe a singer/songwriter or solo performer you could record?  Ask someone in the band if they have any songs laying around they'd like to record.  Put up an ad at the local music store.  Start out giving people a free hour when they book one as a draw.  Just stuff off the top of my head. 

I'm actually doing this to some extent. I want to record some stuff that I normally wouldn't, so I've asked some friends in a doom/sludge metal band if they wanted to do a three song demo with me for free. If they like it, they can keep it, but I get to use excerpts for promo material.

I want to do the same thing with a standup bass/acoustic guitar duo that some other friends are in, as well.

 

5 hours ago, Brooks said:

I wish I had insisted on sax and not been pushed into clarinet back in 6th grade.

Same here. I wanted to play the sax too, but my grandmother was all "But Benny Goodman! Benny Goodman is so great!" and talked my mom into getting me a clarinet. I came to really appreciate some of the great players such as Artie Shaw later in life, but I still wanted to play the sax.

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I have two friends that won Grammys for their engineering work.  One now has a PhD in physics and works in medical research.  The other does sound design for indie films.  I love recording, and in particular I love going to a real, purpose build studio - home studios have no vibe.  But I don't regret not going that direction in the least.  However, if I ever do another album for real, it will be at a real studio... still won't be to 2" though.  I don't even want to know what a reel goes for these days.  But still, that pressure of paying out of pocket to be somewhere purpose built to do that job is my favorite way to record. 

One reason I think music sucks is that it is way too cheap to make a mediocre recording.  Just 20 years ago, even if you were going to an ADAT studio, the best way to end up with a decent product that didn't cost a ton was to come into the studio rehearsed, cut all the bed tracks live, and fuck a click.  ...Man I hate click tracks.  I've recorded to just about every medium in just about every way you can imagine, and nothing screams, "this is going to be lifeless" like the phrase "record it to a click so we can edit it later."  I find tape far more intimidating than any audience, but I also liked the way I prepared and played when I knew the punches and tracks were finite.  I listen to our stuff we cut to analog or even DASH, and there is something to the performance.  The stuff my first band did when we were 19 to ADAT all live is really cool.  Songs and production were a little better later, but there is a zing to that first album that is missing in later stuff. 

Also, some of my best memories in music are when automation would go down, and you'd have the whole band sitting at an SSL doing the fades, pans, and mutes on a mix down live while the engineer conducted things.  Nailing that was almost as fun as playing it. 

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8 minutes ago, LucSulla said:

I have two friends that won Grammys for their engineering work.  One now has a PhD in physics and works in medical research.  The other does sound design for indie films.  I love recording, and in particular I love going to a real, purpose build studio - home studios have no vibe.  But I don't regret not going that direction in the least.  However, if I ever do another album for real, it will be at a real studio... still won't be to 2" though.  I don't even want to know what a reel goes for these days.  But still, that pressure of paying out of pocket to be somewhere purpose built to do that job is my favorite way to record. 

One reason I think music sucks is that it is way too cheap to make a mediocre recording.  Just 20 years ago, even if you were going to an ADAT studio, the best way to end up with a decent product that didn't cost a ton was to come into the studio rehearsed, cut all the bed tracks live, and fuck a click.  ...Man I hate click tracks.  I've recorded to just about every medium in just about every way you can imagine, and nothing screams, "this is going to be lifeless" like the phrase "record it to a click so we can edit it later."  I find tape far more intimidating than any audience, but I also liked the way I prepared and played when I knew the punches and tracks were finite.  I listen to our stuff we cut to analog or even DASH, and there is something to the performance.  The stuff my first band did when we were 19 to ADAT all live is really cool.  Songs and production were a little better later, but there is a zing to that first album that is missing in later stuff. 

Also, some of my best memories in music are when automation would go down, and you'd have the whole band sitting at an SSL doing the fades, pans, and mutes on a mix down live while the engineer conducted things.  Nailing that was almost as fun as playing it. 

I think a home studio CAN have a vibe, but you have to start out putting the vibe in it.  

I agree about the being rehearsed thing.  Sometimes folks have an off day, but it's awful when one person in a group isn't ready and everyone else is.  As far as the click, they could still edit later, it's just that the click makes it easy ON THEM.  They'd just have to spend more time on it.  

I haven't used tape in ages either, but 2" is about $350/reel these days.  There's a place in Nashville that specializes in the old MCI tape machines.  They're fairly priced too.  If I was going to start a recording studio, I'd try to go all analog for music.  Creating a mix without automation and getting it right is indeed a lot of fun.  

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If there was a musical decision that could be changed years later it would have been to not build a home recording studio.  It made me learn as much about home construction as it did recording.  Construction skills have paid off better than recording skills, though.  The money was spent a year or two before digital recording gear became affordable, but a few years before it was feasible to use a desktop computer for recording.  My gear became archaic and outdated.  Andy Sneap has said that he would not go back to tape despite all the people who seem nostalgic about it.  It would not bother me to have fun with it again, and a friend is taking my old recording gear to make it useful again. 

Had I not bought $20,000 worth of recording gear it would have allowed me to have a Marshall stack, an SVT, and a Spector USA bass back in the 80's.  They would still be worth something, too.  The cost of recording with my friends and my last band would have been far cheaper and spread among band members. 

Something else I wish I would have done differently is find ONE guitar that I could play as my number one and ONLY.  The same is true for basses.  Those volume and tone knobs can be used for something other than "wide open."  The reason amps have knobs is to change tone.  Instead of finding one "perfect" tone and leaving it, learning to change settings would have been better.  Instead of having a great guitar collection, having just one guitar and bass could have made me focus more on playing with tones instead of different guitars for different moods. 

 

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45 minutes ago, LucSulla said:

One reason I think music sucks is that it is way too cheap to make a mediocre recording.  Just 20 years ago, even if you were going to an ADAT studio, the best way to end up with a decent product that didn't cost a ton was to come into the studio rehearsed, cut all the bed tracks live, and fuck a click.  ...Man I hate click tracks.  I've recorded to just about every medium in just about every way you can imagine, and nothing screams, "this is going to be lifeless" like the phrase "record it to a click so we can edit it later."  I find tape far more intimidating than any audience, but I also liked the way I prepared and played when I knew the punches and tracks were finite.  I listen to our stuff we cut to analog or even DASH, and there is something to the performance.  The stuff my first band did when we were 19 to ADAT all live is really cool.  Songs and production were a little better later, but there is a zing to that first album that is missing in later stuff. 

Also, some of my best memories in music are when automation would go down, and you'd have the whole band sitting at an SSL doing the fades, pans, and mutes on a mix down live while the engineer conducted things.  Nailing that was almost as fun as playing it. 

I definitely agree about needing to get ready and rehearsing when recording to tape. there's a certain edge and excitement when that red button is pressed that's sometimes missing with a DAW. We'd have "acceptable flubs". Too many, or a really bad one, and it was a retake, but just a couple little things? Meh, that was a great take. Next!

These days? Screw up? Punch it in. Loop that friggin' solo until you nail it, or assemble one from multiple takes.

A click though? I don't mind recording with one for some things, but sometimes it can really ruin a song that should have loose feel. Since most delay plugins and even some compressors can be timed to the beat, having everything to click makes sense to me. A good compromise though, is to do the count-off to the click to set the tempo, then let the chips fall where they may.

I have some fond memories of doing the automation dance, too, but I much prefer DAW automation these days.

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I would so LOVE being in a band that made it and was given a week or 3 days or whatever to spend full-time in a “real” studio....I get the ‘red light blues’ every single time I punch record...and I know I can fix it...but I don’t fix it. Not usually. If it is my guitar I go for the whole take...if I screw it up, delete.and do it again. I try to commit to everything I can and I record like I am in an old studio where you gotta get it right at the mic....I play better thinking with Lucsulla’s mentality for sure.

I agree on the home studio vibe......I would have loved recording my parts live and then following the engineer around asking questions and being a PITA...I would have learned a lot...and prolly not been asked back!

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23 minutes ago, Steve Haynie said:

If there was a musical decision that could be changed years later it would have been to not build a home recording studio.  It made me learn as much about home construction as it did recording.  Construction skills have paid off better than recording skills, though.  The money was spent a year or two before digital recording gear became affordable, but a few years before it was feasible to use a desktop computer for recording.  My gear became archaic and outdated.  Andy Sneap has said that he would not go back to tape despite all the people who seem nostalgic about it.  It would not bother me to have fun with it again, and a friend is taking my old recording gear to make it useful again. 

Had I not bought $20,000 worth of recording gear it would have allowed me to have a Marshall stack, an SVT, and a Spector USA bass back in the 80's.  They would still be worth something, too.  The cost of recording with my friends and my last band would have been far cheaper and spread among band members. 

Something else I wish I would have done differently is find ONE guitar that I could play as my number one and ONLY.  The same is true for basses.  Those volume and tone knobs can be used for something other than "wide open."  The reason amps have knobs is to change tone.  Instead of finding one "perfect" tone and leaving it, learning to change settings would have been better.  Instead of having a great guitar collection, having just one guitar and bass could have made me focus more on playing with tones instead of different guitars for different moods. 

 

Sneap is right. Some of the biggest names in the music production biz just show up with a laptop full of plugins, a DAW, and some sort of interface and make Grammy winning music. Many of them say they still have racks of equipment, but when a plugin gets you 95% of what the outboard gear does with less hassle, your gear starts gathering dust.

I blame the HFC for me not being that guy with only one guitar :lol:

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2 hours ago, Lockbody said:

 

A click though? I don't mind recording with one for some things, but sometimes it can really ruin a song that should have loose feel. Since most delay plugins and even some compressors can be timed to the beat, having everything to click makes sense to me. A good compromise though, is to do the count-off to the click to set the tempo, then let the chips fall where they may.

 

We were pretty hardcore.  We'd track with a click, but we also rehearsed with one when we were doing a lot of recording.  We'd run a metronome through the PA and play to it.  The last album, the drummer did all the bed tracks by himself.  No one playing live and no scratch tracks.  There was a click so we could count the rests for later, but it was mostly him in the room playing from memory.  We even rehearsed pulling on and off the click where sections warranted it, which is super easy when the drummer is the only guy playing when the tracks are actually getting laid.  Got through drum beds in eight hours on 10 songs.  The music may have sucked as far as the songwriting, but we were a pretty well oiled machine at executing our shitty music, haha.  Here is a rough from a song that never got fully mixed (hence the bad vocals takes here and there).
 

 

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Yeah, if you thought guitar GAS was bad...   Go lurk on gearslutz.  Those guys blow so much money on gear it's crazy.  I'd like to think a lot of them are making it back by recording bands and whatnot, but ... probably not as many as I'd hope.  :)

As far as "going a different direction" goes, it's almost never too late to do something different.  As others have said, either step back from this for a while and "miss" it for a while or pivot into something else and give that your attention for now.  While I'd be reluctant to expect to make any kind of living recording bands these days, if don't have that expectation going into it, it could be fun.

 

Especially if you always wanted to be a therapist and a childcare worker too, since in small studios you also may get that "producer" credit which can imply those roles.  :D 

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I just wish I knew now what I knew when I was buying all my crap. I have so much junk lying around that I bought because it was an "informed choice" and not the "right choice".

Like that damned TSL122, or that Carvin MTS3212. 100 watt 2x12 combos are evil.

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2 hours ago, sixesandsevens said:

Yeah, if you thought guitar GAS was bad...   Go lurk on gearslutz.  Those guys blow so much money on gear it's crazy.  I'd like to think a lot of them are making it back by recording bands and whatnot, but ... probably not as many as I'd hope.  :)

 

I think those guys are insane.  That stuff is nice,  but I'd take a good engineer and mediocre gear over good gear and a mediocre engineer.

I did a session where we miked both heads of a four piece kit with u87s (didn't sound that great, but what the hell) and tracked through Neve console to a 2" analog.  I believe we did the vocals with a u47 used during the Sgt. Pepper sessions.  I forget how much the client-pleaser monitors were, but it was a lot.  As such, I never get studio GAS because not only is the best stuff so ridiculously out of my price range but...

...it really wasn't all that much better sounding at the end of the day :ph34r:

A lot of really good shit out there done with nothing more than a four-track, some SM57s, and a pair of NS-10s. 

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