Crimsontider

$400 for a USA Hamer sounds like a steal. I have heard by many hear that the Diablo was under priced by Hamer out the gate, does that have any relationship to the current market price? Or is it considered a 5 to 6 hundred dollar guitar based on the sound and quality? If you can get one for $400, I cannot think of another guitar for Rock at that price that matches it.

It's not just about his singing voice, but inventive phrasing and melodies he has concocted through the decades. But yes, he has(d) strong pipes and sings spot on in tune, which is what was disputed, by a freaking Kiss fan! I have no other comment unless someone is directing it at me. We all have our opinions. it's like arguing over if tomatoes taste good. And please take my Kiss remarks with sarcasm, they are not my cup of tea, but I bought Kiss Alive, the solo albums and even owned the Kiss pinball machine....that I wish I still had. If I was born 10 years earlier, maybe I would have liked them more. So in that light. I am pulling out.

I obviously have different taste than Cynic because he always shows up when I am debating someone. There is just as many or more anti Kiss comments in this board than Ozzie, or at least I would hope so. Hear is some more lip syncing? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jSNuIzw9VfU

I think this is mainly a semantic argument at this point. To say Ozzy was a great singer and Ray Gillen was not seems backward to me. I am not claiming fact, but my opinion. Ozzie is the perfect person when countering generic. His voice is clear, appealing, unique, and pitch perfect. I have yet to hear anyone that sounds like Ozzie, same with Jake and Viv, they all had distinctive style. So this is semantic, but I could probably find singers similar in tone and timbre to Gillen and few if any that sound like Ozzie. I guess you either love or hate Ozzie, but the dude has some pipes. has unique phrasing and melodies.and that perfect pitch sound is awesome. See how many Gillen singing melodies you have memorized vs Ozzie. Just want to make clear that I believe both those guys are good, but not at the top tier level. Jake and Vivian's bands might have been more successful if they had not been in their prior bands. What?!??!? Ozzy? Pipes? Perfect pitch? I'm not an Ozzy hater but I never thought I'd see those terms used to describe his singing! Strong pipes and hitting notes. Not to mention the distinctiveness of his sound. Come on! Are you serious that you never heard that associated with Ozzie? My conclusion is that Ozzie makes it sound too simple. Find me a Ozzie Cover band in the meantime, let's see how easy it is. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hbwxGBh-AbE You do realize that is a dubbed vocal right? Was it processed? You would be deaf not to hear the stereo layer. Not sure if it is done with a live effect or later, but he's singing live, so what? He tapered this down during the next few years, but I like it. Do you not see any greatness in the melodies that Ozzie puts on top of his music? If not, we just have different ears for music. Just out of curiosity, what were your favorite bands growing up. Some influences. Someone here can correct me if I am wrong on this, but I believe the dub was done post-concert. It seems a relevant point to make as it appeared you were using that clip to underscore your point of Ozzy having strong pipes and hitting notes... There are several live Ozzy clips others have posted that demonstrate a much different result with regard to hitting notes and such. This isn't an indictment of Ozzy - I am a fan - Black Sabbath through Blizzard, Diary of a Madman, BATM... My favorite bands varied growing up - Anything from Zeppelin, AC/DC, KISS, Van Halen to Earth Wind & Fire. Influences are WIDE ranging and include artists known more for songwriting (including my favorite bands) and others known more for instrumental work... Kiss, that figures and I don't debate talent with people that worshiped Kiss.

Vinnie and Dio kind of meshed. I agree that having Vinnie here was extremely important, he has a very distinct dynamic style that is not easy to replicate. Vinnie kind of has this tight and restrained style that produces clear dynamics. Great underrated drummer, or at least not mentioned as much as he should be as one of the better drummers.

Ozzie is not about this one video, so I respect your opinions and just beg to differ. Let's get back to the topic I disrupted. Vivian, one of my 3 favorite guitarist. Whom many people feel the same way some do about Ozzie. Art is subjective. And a forum is a bad place to accomplish your point of view.

I think this is mainly a semantic argument at this point. To say Ozzy was a great singer and Ray Gillen was not seems backward to me. I am not claiming fact, but my opinion. Ozzie is the perfect person when countering generic. His voice is clear, appealing, unique, and pitch perfect. I have yet to hear anyone that sounds like Ozzie, same with Jake and Viv, they all had distinctive style. So this is semantic, but I could probably find singers similar in tone and timbre to Gillen and few if any that sound like Ozzie. I guess you either love or hate Ozzie, but the dude has some pipes. has unique phrasing and melodies.and that perfect pitch sound is awesome. See how many Gillen singing melodies you have memorized vs Ozzie. Just want to make clear that I believe both those guys are good, but not at the top tier level. Jake and Vivian's bands might have been more successful if they had not been in their prior bands. What?!??!? Ozzy? Pipes? Perfect pitch? I'm not an Ozzy hater but I never thought I'd see those terms used to describe his singing! Strong pipes and hitting notes. Not to mention the distinctiveness of his sound. Come on! Are you serious that you never heard that associated with Ozzie? My conclusion is that Ozzie makes it sound too simple. Find me a Ozzie Cover band in the meantime, let's see how easy it is. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hbwxGBh-AbE You do realize that is a dubbed vocal right? Was it processed? You would be deaf not to hear the stereo layer. Not sure if it is done with a live effect or later, but he's singing live, so what? He tapered this down during the next few years, but I like it. Do you not see any greatness in the melodies that Ozzie puts on top of his music? If not, we just have different ears for music. Just out of curiosity, what were your favorite bands growing up. Some influences.

Since I started the Ozzie rant, anyone can post a rebuttal and have the last word, and I will let this get back on topic without responding.............as long as it's not a picture of a glass cock.

Imo, Ozzie is not a great vocalist techniques wise, but his strengths lie in phrasing/melodies and a infectious, usually in tune voice. He sings in maybe 2 Octaves, but I have yet to see anyone imitate him.....trying to sound like him. He has sold close to 100 million records, with revolving band mates, and never really sold out musically until very late in his music career. You could compare him to a guitarist like The Edge, in that someone could knock him for minimalistic ways, but the depth of melodies and other esthetics are what stand out. With me it's always been about the quality of a note over the quantity, or either it sounds good or it doesn't, no need to analyze.

I will bring this back to Viv, whom is one of my favorite guitarist. His tone is more crafted here than the rawness of his earlier years, but it is inline with someone that has progressed past the metal box. I noticed that he used his neck pup very effectively in this video, and I think he tailored his sound around both pups giving him a good warm tone. He sure looks like he is working his ass of. He had a lot of energy when he was young and he is now facing that head on. Vinnie on drums is essential to making this a great band. I hope they continue to honor Dio. The dude that started out singing dew-wop.

It's called a passionate debate, not a cheap cop out over my last name lol, but If you want to go down that road, here you are.

I think this is mainly a semantic argument at this point. To say Ozzy was a great singer and Ray Gillen was not seems backward to me. I am not claiming fact, but my opinion. Ozzie is the perfect person when countering generic. His voice is clear, appealing, unique, and pitch perfect. I have yet to hear anyone that sounds like Ozzie, same with Jake and Viv, they all had distinctive style. So this is semantic, but I could probably find singers similar in tone and timbre to Gillen and few if any that sound like Ozzie. I guess you either love or hate Ozzie, but the dude has some pipes. has unique phrasing and melodies.and that perfect pitch sound is awesome. See how many Gillen singing melodies you have memorized vs Ozzie. Just want to make clear that I believe both those guys are good, but not at the top tier level. Jake and Vivian's bands might have been more successful if they had not been in their prior bands. What?!??!? Ozzy? Pipes? Perfect pitch? I'm not an Ozzy hater but I never thought I'd see those terms used to describe his singing! Strong pipes and hitting notes. Not to mention the distinctiveness of his sound. Come on! Are you serious that you never heard that associated with Ozzie? My conclusion is that Ozzie makes it sound too simple. Find me a Ozzie Cover band in the meantime, let's see how easy it is. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hbwxGBh-AbE

I think this is mainly a semantic argument at this point. To say Ozzy was a great singer and Ray Gillen was not seems backward to me. I am not claiming fact, but my opinion. Ozzie is the perfect person when countering generic. His voice is clear, appealing, unique, and pitch perfect. I have yet to hear anyone that sounds like Ozzie, same with Jake and Viv, they all had distinctive style. So this is semantic, but I could probably find singers similar in tone and timbre to Gillen and few if any that sound like Ozzie. I guess you either love or hate Ozzie, but the dude has some pipes. has unique phrasing and melodies.and that perfect pitch sound is awesome. See how many Gillen singing melodies you have memorized vs Ozzie. Just want to make clear that I believe both those guys are good, but not at the top tier level. Jake and Vivian's bands might have been more successful if they had not been in their prior bands.

Vivian looked like he was working pretty hard. Something that he has not had to do the the recent past. Not sure I've ever heard Lou Gramm and Ray Gillen described as generic. What ever you want to call it, they went from great singers to good or very good, and who both went on to sell more records than the guitarist. With both Badlands and Riverdogs the singing was a major step down. I liked them both, but something psychological had me yearning for a better singer.

Having Vinnie Appice makes a huge difference. I have yet to hear a drummer that can replicate his early Dio grooves. He and Carmine have that unique approach and dynamics with their snare, bass and cymbals.

I have watched Dio Live at the Spectrum with Viv so many times that I know it in Rocky Horror picture show type depths. Every "Yeeeh Oh!" to his mistake during the opening song, and into the crowd reaction. I can recreate the concert in my head. A bowl and Dio was a ritual for about 3 years. It was very interesting to hear Viv say recently that he didn't realize how good he was with the Dio, at that age, and felt inferior to other guitarist. But he now gets it.......what put him over the top was the energy he had. The difference between the viv and Craig Goldie Spectrum concerts is light and day. I wonder if Vivian might have taken another path if he had known his talents. Taking over for Sykes and then Steve Clark pretty much marginalized what he could do. He did not need to be a fill in. He is about as polar to Steve Clark as you can get. Guitarist like VIvian and Jake E. Lee had good bands but with very generic singers. But at least it was their music.

This is good. In typical fashion the Japenese put out some good competition and had a knack for highlighting some of the better aspects of metal in condensed fashion. I liked EZO, There is I believe there is only one pinch harmonic at the end of the lead.

The only critic I ever liked was Roger Ebert. If he liked a movie, I did too. Probably 500 bad critics to 1 good one, and many critics are corrupt these days. I don't even know why we have music critics, people's taste are so different, and if you don't understand the influences behind the music, or how it evolved, you are out to pasture. you will not understand it.

Ah Weather Report. Back in the drum line in HS and college 82-88, the people that listened to Rush thought they were at the edge. but some of us had moved past Rush in middle school and were exploring Fusion Jazz, so we felt one notch up. I loved Weather Report, Return to Forever's Romantic Warrior, Miles Bitches Brew, Chick Corea, Yes. Your typical garage band didn't know who Bill Bruford or Stanley was back then. It was either Peart, Copeland, Bonzo or Tommy Lee. I grew up with my dad's Bee-Bop, cool Jazz. Sinatra and all the great female jazz singers. Bill Evans is the one that I ended up liking the most. My dad was a big Miles Davis fan but could not grasp Bitches Brew, he though Miles was on drugs. Now he knows Miles was always on drugs! Loudness: Action on guitar low enough to basically play entire songs, chords and all with varying degree of pinch harmonics. I am not sure what the guitar would sound like if he played chords without his thumb involved. Might sound dead or have some buzz. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4VvPjnY0naE

You mentioned Alabama in your post. I live in a small but very nice town in North Central Alabama called Cullman. We started a music festival a few years ago called Rock the South and it continues to grow into one of the better festivals in the south, and we are just a dinky town. It is about a mile from my house and this year's lineup in a week is: Little Big Town, Lynyard Skynyrd . Charlie Daniels Band, Billy Currington, Cort Ford, Sara Evans, Easton Corbin and Dee Jay Silver. While this is no dream lineup, and I am not a country fan, for $39 and a 10 minute walk, I can see some good talent. And all in my little 25,000 no name town. I hope they continue to add more southern rock bands in the future.

Well, he was pretty bad ass back in the day. Then well... I think it just got easier to be in the Zakk Wylde business. That was 9 minutes of my life wasted.................. Don't normally mind being wasted (and I know its only Rock n Roll etc and is expected in the Ozzy scenario) but that was one of the most boring and self indulgent guitar solos I've ever heard, I kept hoping it would get better but it didn't, is this the peak of his ability?Anyone got a better example of Zakk's playing ? Not saying I could do better (for sure) but mostly it seemed to be the same couple of phrases over and over again. Must admit to not having searched out any of his stuff before now and don't think this is going to make me want to. Much respect to Zakk for making it so far with such a limited vocabulary. This started out exposing all he had and then proceeded to go Tap. Maybe Sharon thought she could use Zakk as a spy to keep Ozzie off the bottle, because there is no comparison between the Jake and Zakk solo's on this thread page. Maybe Sharron thought Jake was a bad influence for the off and on the wagon Oz. Zakk took Ozzie back to straight power chords unlike Randy and Jake. Boring.

No doubt. But love or hate these two (I've noted a bit of dislike for Vai on here) Vai and Satch IMO wield pinch harmonics as well as any of those already mentioned. Both have seamlessly incorporated them into their playing as an effective, expressive tool and not just a gimmick, or a crutch as in the case of Zakk. I always think of those two as the Ibanez guys. They have probably done more for Ibanez than any promotions or advertising ever. I probably liked Vai better, who I believe was a student of Satrioni, until I watched a Chickenfoot concert on AXE. It blew me away and I finally understood what all the fuss was about. It's great that Sammy took Michael Anthony under his wing after he was just unfailry left out of VH, one of the worst examples of disloyalty I have ever seen. The dude is underrated. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SRSwhsu-kdI

Probably because there are 100's of great pitch harmonic moments? 0:55 is a good one. I just love Jake, he has that style where pinch harmonics just happen because of the way he plays. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nWAohdmCl4o

Here's one out of left field. Not religious, but I watch Jimmy Swaggart's SBN network because his church is loaded with Nashville Session Musician's. A dude playing some rock gospel with a telecaster was constantly playing subtle pinch harmonics. It's just a style with many. If you like to play tight, the pinches are improvised flavoring, like that squawking fat sound that sax players make that gets everyone's attention. You want to see top notch Gospel Music? watch the SBN channel. It's 580 and 1580 for HD with U-Verse. Great improvised 30 minute jam session's.

Yes there is a big difference between the sound of a harmonic and a pinch harmonic. Just about every metal guitarist that plays heavy is going to have a few pinch harmonic, you nearly can't help it. Listen to Meanstreet chorus, it has mean pinch harmonic's followed by regular harmonics. "This is home" BUM BUM BUM BUM WAAAAAAA! This is meanstreet - then regular harmonics with the last diving. Pinch harmonics on the A and E string down low sound great. A very common usage is pinching the e string on the "G" note, which Eddie does on the Verse in Meanstreet.