SteveB Posted September 30, 2010 Share Posted September 30, 2010 from high E to Low E string... E C A D C F#it's most natural name is D9, but what would you call this as a variation on Am? Its not really suspended because it still has the third. Am+4/F#? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hackubus Posted September 30, 2010 Share Posted September 30, 2010 Amadd11/F#? Am6add11/F#? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thundernotes Posted September 30, 2010 Share Posted September 30, 2010 According to the calculator, it's a F#dimFind this handy little tool at: http://www.gootar.com/guitar/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hardheartedbill Posted September 30, 2010 Share Posted September 30, 2010 how in the hell are you fingering that? to really "name" it we need the key Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burningyen Posted September 30, 2010 Share Posted September 30, 2010 how in the hell are you fingering that? to really "name" it we need the keyThumb the F# would be my guess.If A is the root, then I would call it Am#6add4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hardheartedbill Posted September 30, 2010 Share Posted September 30, 2010 shit I'm reading it backwards! F# min7 b5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hackubus Posted September 30, 2010 Share Posted September 30, 2010 I read it backwards before I figured out which way to point this sucker. Spider fingers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harry65 Posted September 30, 2010 Share Posted September 30, 2010 it's D9 , plain and simple................ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveB Posted September 30, 2010 Author Share Posted September 30, 2010 how in the hell are you fingering that? to really "name" it we need the key Thumb the F# would be my guess. If A is the root, then I would call it Am#6add4. on a classical guitar thumb = illegal, not to mention difficult. Its not that hard to finger, just in first position. It's being used as an Am variation which is why I was trying to name it with A root. Key is C. Why #6 though? F# is the major 6 in A major scale. Arn't chords usually named assuming a major scale from the root? According to the calculator, it's a F#dim Find this handy little tool at: http://www.gootar.com/guitar/ actually open strings are sounded so not an F# dim. That tool calls it an F#m flat 5 aug5 7th. Or in Am form it calls it a Am sus4 6th, but I thought the sus nomenclature was only used if the third is not present. whats the rule on whether to call something a add4 verses add11? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burningyen Posted September 30, 2010 Share Posted September 30, 2010 Why #6 though? F# is the major 6 in A major scale. Arn't chords usually named assuming a major scale from the root?The way I was taught, A6 is assumed to have an F# in it, Am6 is assumed to have an F in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveB Posted September 30, 2010 Author Share Posted September 30, 2010 ok, more reading seems to indicate the following can be true of chord names.... that if you use "11" it implies a 7 whereas if you use "4" it does not, and that "Slash" chords do not necessarily mean that the referenced bass note is included in the chord name. Given that I think I'm calling this an Am add 4/F# ( not +4 because I forgot that means augmented) . I think if most guitarists read "Am add 4/F#" they could just about guess the correct fingering. Most guitarists being ME in this case when I read it later. Of course I really should just put down a chord grid too.This thing shows up at the end of a flamenco cadence where the basic tonality is Am G7 C. So with Am/F# G7 C creates a little moving bass line, and I guess my teacher threw in the add4 because it sounds cool.I also had to train my hand to not full bar F chords, because he often leaves the high B and E strings open. I guess that would be a Fmaj7#11 or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyB Posted September 30, 2010 Share Posted September 30, 2010 it's D9 , plain and simple................Once you build out a chord to a sixth or above, it shares the notes with other chords depending on the context, progression, and accompanying bass note. For example, ACEG could be Am7 but it shares the exact same notes with CM6. So there's no one answer to the question as posed, but D9 is one answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harry65 Posted September 30, 2010 Share Posted September 30, 2010 it's D9 , plain and simple................ Once you build out a chord to a sixth or above, it shares the notes with other chords depending on the context, progression, and accompanying bass note. For example, ACEG could be Am7 but it shares the exact same notes with CM6. So there's no one answer to the question as posed, but D9 is one answer. i look at it from a jazz perspective the way i was taught , it's a d9 chord with an F# in the bass , , it is true there a many ways to look at it , i prefer to keep it simple and it's dominant tonality is a D dominant chord with an added 9.............. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyB Posted October 1, 2010 Share Posted October 1, 2010 it's D9 , plain and simple................ Once you build out a chord to a sixth or above, it shares the notes with other chords depending on the context, progression, and accompanying bass note. For example, ACEG could be Am7 but it shares the exact same notes with CM6. So there's no one answer to the question as posed, but D9 is one answer. i look at it from a jazz perspective the way i was taught , it's a d9 chord with an F# in the bass , , it is true there a many ways to look at it , i prefer to keep it simple and it's dominant tonality is a D dominant chord with an added 9.............. Being a bit of a jazzer myself, that's how I approach it as a bassist. I'm going to try to sound the note that best emphasizes where the song is going at that point, but if I miss it and hit something else that's in that chord, it'll usually do. I consider jazz the home or chord substitutions, and that's how to keep some sanity with all those big complex chords. There is always a simple expression at the heart of it, e.g., Count Basie and Freddie Green. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hardheartedbill Posted October 1, 2010 Share Posted October 1, 2010 if it's coming from/to a G I see it as a diminished sound on the non diatonic F#, classic walk up/down. ps it's sort of 6 or one 1/2 dozen situation. I playing it now, really the D note makes it's it D9ish but you can do the F# dim to the same effect Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveB Posted October 1, 2010 Author Share Posted October 1, 2010 if it's coming from/to a G I see it as a diminished sound on the non diatonic F#, classic walk up/down. yeah I could see that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyB Posted October 1, 2010 Share Posted October 1, 2010 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burningyen Posted October 1, 2010 Share Posted October 1, 2010 What you call the chord depends on what its role is in the song. The OP said that the chord is being used as an A chord, so we should take his word for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hardheartedbill Posted October 1, 2010 Share Posted October 1, 2010 well, if it's an A of some kind you have to determine if the Cs are really minor thirds or raised 9s. obviously in C it should be an Am so that would be Am (a c e ) maj6 ( the F# ) plus 4 ( the d ). a really great book on this kind of stuff is Mikey Baker jazz series.ps two raised 9s is not gonna happen, this chord is the rabbit hole!!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyB Posted October 1, 2010 Share Posted October 1, 2010 ...A really great book on this kind of stuff is Mickey Baker jazz series. Yep, Part 1 and Part 2. In case you ever wondered what those very retro-looking guitar books were on the rack, here they are. Mickey Baker was the "Mickey" of Mickey & Sylvia, the duo who had the early '60s hit, "Love is Strange." You'd never know from the twangy guitar part in that song that he was such a comprehensive jazzer. Learn the first page of chords and do a few of the rhythm exercises and you'd be surprised how far it can take you in jazz comping. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brooks Posted October 1, 2010 Share Posted October 1, 2010 it's D9 , plain and simple................ i agree. but HHB has a point, there's often more than one way to name chords. that said, i was taught in school years ago to always 1st try to spell a regular tertian (thirds based) chord w/ all the notes (regardless of their order), if you do that its obviously an inverted (or "re-voiced") D9 ( root position spelling would be D F# A C E ). funny, i'm having a very similar mild pissing contest over on the rush board r/e the 3rd chord in "spirit of radio", low to high voiced G# E B B E (i'ts an E chord w/ the 3rd in the bass, but guys there are calling it a G# chord ). edit: i did not (and will not bother) reading all of the replies, so please don't feel insulted if you think its something else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feynman Posted October 1, 2010 Share Posted October 1, 2010 Baker and Greene have so much to offer. Everyone should have this one, too. I like the older cover on account of the epic beard. Ted's style made a lot of this stuff accessible to a dumbarse like myself. P.S. I can assure you that owning all of these books won't do squat for you. You have to actually open and read and apply them, or so I've been told. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveB Posted October 1, 2010 Author Share Posted October 1, 2010 P.S. I can assure you that owning all of these books won't do squat for you. You have to actually open and read and apply them, or so I've been told.crap... that explains why that shelf full of guitar books doesn't seem to be having any effect... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveB Posted October 1, 2010 Author Share Posted October 1, 2010 funny, i'm having a very similar mild pissing contest over on the rush board r/e the 3rd chord in "spirit of radio", low to high voiced G# E B B E (i'ts an E chord w/ the 3rd in the bass, but guys there are calling it a G# chord ). Given the choice between E and G#m#5 I think I'd take E. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyB Posted October 1, 2010 Share Posted October 1, 2010 funny, i'm having a very similar mild pissing contest over on the rush board r/e the 3rd chord in "spirit of radio", low to high voiced G# E B B E (i'ts an E chord w/ the 3rd in the bass, but guys there are calling it a G# chord ). Given the choice between E and G#m#5 I think I'd take E. Yeah, that's Music Theory 101. When you use the 3rd as the bass note, you omit it from the chord voicing to avoid a clash. You can double the root or the dominant in the bass but when you do it with the third it doesn't sound right, so you leave it out of the chord. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brooks Posted October 2, 2010 Share Posted October 2, 2010 Yeah, that's Music Theory 101. When you use the 3rd as the bass note, you omit it from the chord voicing to avoid a clash. You can double the root or the dominant in the bass but when you do it with the third it doesn't sound right, so you leave it out of the chord.huh? i musta missed that day. i think you're confusing the practice in jazz to omit the 3rd in a 13th chord to avoid the minor 2nd clash between the 3rd & 11th. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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SteveB
from high E to Low E string... E C A D C F#
it's most natural name is D9, but what would you call this as a variation on Am? Its not really suspended because it still has the third. Am+4/F#?
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