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Does gear REALLY matter??


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On 04/03/2016 at 4:09 PM, polara said:
19 hours ago, gtrdaddy said:

 In my experience, digital can be fantastic for recording purposes, They can come close with heavy metal, high gain sounds or heavily processed sounds, but in my experience, nowhere near close when it comes to cleaner styles. Haven't tried the Kemper yet, but I'm half willing to bet I'll have the same result. 

 

 

You're right on the money with this observation. I play 95% of our set using just two Kemper profiles (both variations of EVH5150/Mesa 4x12" with V30's dual-miked with an SM57 and a Neumann) and they both melt faces. The cleaner profiles I use (Fender Twin etc.) just aren't as good, harmonically rich, or as responsive. We just bought an original old Roland JC120 to see if we can get better clean tone profiles.

 

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Does gear matter?  To me it does but to a point.  The fingers matter more.

I have some nice gear and get very good sounds being an Axe FX convert after years with tube amps.

As for guitars I'll always gravitate to what I can afford.  I used to rely on cheaper well set up guitars back in the day but that doesnt mean I dont prefer higher quality (and often more expensive) custom instruments. 

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  • 3 months later...

As long as I have one of my three Flextone III amps (mono 1x12) with gold leaf Marshall logos and one of my two controller pedal boards, I'll be fine.  I use two amp models, the compressor, delay, chorus/flange and the wah.  I get no deeper.  I just sold my Helix.  It was so good, I hated it.  I don't need that many choices.  Guitars, however, I do. 

I play at a very low volume.  I have really good microphones (Royer).  The JCM Silver Jubilee and 100wt Plexi work well in a live band situation.  If I have to crank up, not so much. So, I have to have a good PA.

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On March 5, 2016 at 9:33 AM, polara said:

Some good points here, and yeah gear matters.

  • Give me a Les Paul and a JCM800 and I'll make one sound
  • A Strat into a Pignose another
  • A Yairi classical another
  • A piano another
  • A trombone another
  • A bag of marbles yet another

There's only so much tone coming from the fingers. But I've come to the conclusion that if I have decent-quality electric guitar essentials - solid body guitar, cable, dirt/delay/modulation, amplification - I'll always end up sounding pretty much he same whether the logos on said gear are Huber and Klon and Dumble, or Cort and Boss and Crate

Obviously you should ENJOY the gear. Like I sold my Shishkov because the big pointy shape was weird to hold. But functionally it's not really that vital to be picky about gear, I think.

Yeah, but does the musical phrase you play sound like you in all those cases?  

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I think, to some extent, the most important role gear plays can be inspiration. It may or may not make you sound a certain way (I'm one of those who tends to sound the same on everything for better or worse), but if hearing a certain sound through a Fender twin, finding a tone on a Kemper, the way the light hits your R9, or the wicked sounds you are getting out of a $200 Yamaha gives you a certain feeling, then it matters. 

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It really only matters if you want it to matter and to the folks like us who listen to tone.  But if it gets you to play your best, then sure, it matters.  Look at the rig rundown videos and how ridiculous some of those things are.  Billy Gibbons' tech has a digital EQ that he makes every guitar have the same EQ curve so Billy can play all those wacky guitars and the same sound is basically coming out.  However, I'm pretty sure if you gave Billy a tele and an old single knob amp from the 50s, he could still pull his songs and his identity from it. 

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Gear matters -- absolutely. Gear is usually an evolving process (sometime devolving) in a guitarist's arsenal, and hopefully his skill is evolving too and the two keep pace.  Sure great players can coax great things out of less than stellar gear -- but bad gear -- as in guitars that can't be intoned or tuned, or amps that sound like ass, or stuff that fritz'-out and breaks down.... it's like buying cheap tools. I've got great gear and great tools.... and when I put my wrench on something it doesn't slip and chew the heads off bolts --- I'm a shitty mechanic but my tools wont fuck up your engine - my lack of skill will.  Bad music gear is the same.  Don't believe me? Go to a local blues jam and put an old peavey bandit on the stage and watch shitty players and seasoned pros sound like the same ass.  Gear matters.

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Gear to a guitarist is like colors to an artist... you start with black a white, move on to all kinds of glorious colors... then after time you can go back to simply black and white and still move people.

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On March 4, 2016 at 3:23 AM, RobB said:

I think you answered your own question in your previous paragraphs. Your touch/approach to playing happens (or happened?) to transcend whatever quality of gear you play through. I think many guys/gals in the "internet guitar webosphere" can honestly look back to what they were playing when they were coming up and might say, "hell, I got a pretty good sound with very primitive gear! I've all this STUFF now, but it may not essentially sound any better..."

Many have heard the story about when Ted Nugent asked EVH's roadie if he could plug into Eddie's rig at a stadium show soundcheck. He sounded just like "Ted", albeit with a flanger/phaser.

Roger Mayer said he used to travel with the JHE with multiple FuzzFaces. At one show, Jimi's screaming at Roger to swap out his fuzzbox. Roger complies, Jimi screams again to bring out another. Roger again complies. This happens five or six times until Roger finally plugged in the original box (unknown to Hendrix) that Jimi said was "bad." Jimi smiled, "now THAT'S what I'm talking about." Mayer said he shrugged and laughed it off. He quipped, "it's funny, but I think a lot of guitar players are like that."

Nice post, Toby. Lot's of food for thought, to be sure...

 

This pretty much sums it all up ^^^^^^^

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40 minutes ago, Nathan of Brainfertilizer Fame said:

Yamaha FTW.

Regarding this video and the subject of which is better, I think it's best to get a real quality guitar or bass first.

Then spend the amount you have left on a cheaper amp.

 

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When I bought my first "real" bass, a 1973 Fender Precision, I played it through an SVT head and 8-10" cab at the music store.

I was absolutely sure that I would sound just like the bass players I saw on In Concert and Midnight Special etc.

Because that's all it was right? LOL!

Boy that was a humbling shock to my newbie bass playing system.

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To me, guitars impart primarily a tactile impression/response, whereas amps impart a tonal one. Not that tone isn't critical to one's perception of a guitar, and not that we cannot "feel" an amp's response,  but a poorly setup, balanced, or constructed guitar won't even get through a tone test with me. 

In other words, gear matters  to me. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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3 minutes ago, Biz Prof said:

To me, guitars impart primarily a tactile impression/response, whereas amps impart a tonal one. Not that tone isn't critical to one's perception of a guitar, and not that we cannot "feel" an amp's response,  but a poorly setup, balanced, or constructed guitar won't even get through a tone test with me. 

In other words, gear matters  to me. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Yeah, the guitar is more of a personal fit and creative tool like a painters brush.

It has to feel right in the hands, balanced, pliable, subtle or forceful.

An amp is more like the paint on the pallet applied to the canvas.

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I am with murkat.   Yes you will sound like you no matter what you play on.  But......   play on a crappy $79 guitar and just as crappy of an amp and tell me you sound as good.  No you don't    Somebody mentioned nuances.   What happens when you want feedback and can't get it because of the gear you are playing on ?

How about when you want overtones, harmonics etc..  and can't get them because of the gear you are playing on.

At a certain point gear does make a difference.   Listen to some Vai and Santana songs.  Notice some really cool parts where the notes sustain forever ?  Do you think that is their fingers holding the string ever so magically ?   No - it is a sustainer in their guitar.   Why do people have threads and disagreements about the magical tone Eddy got on the first and maybe second album but not the rest of them  hmm...???  Tone is  BOTH hands and gear.   And it is a mix.   You will sound like you but you maybe are not able to get the nuances you usually do due to shitty gear.

So yes gear will make a difference.  Of course your technique is more important but that is not the subject of this thread.   I once read a story about Yngwie going into a music store and playing the standard Strats and he sounded like shit.   All the professionals are into gear.   Why does Pink Floyd use Peter Cornish products ?

Why do you play a Hamer guitar ?  Go buy something at Walmart that is never in tune, where it frets out when you hit that 21st fret you like to hit regularly, where the harmonics and octaves are off because the saddles are lined up wrong or the frets were put in by Koreans or Chinese etc....

Try all day to get that dark Les Paul mahogony sound with a Parker Fly or single coil cheap Strat copy and tell me gear does not matter.

 

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13 hours ago, scottcald said:

Yeah, but does the musical phrase you play sound like you in all those cases?  

To a degree yes, but if I play my band's set on my Bluesbird through the Marshall model on my Line 6...

..then the same set playing the Ibanez with single-coils through the Fender model...

...even Mom can hear the difference. 

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13 hours ago, Dasein said:

Gear matters -- absolutely. Gear is usually an evolving process (sometime devolving) in a guitarist's arsenal, and hopefully his skill is evolving too and the two keep pace.  Sure great players can coax great things out of less than stellar gear -- but bad gear -- as in guitars that can't be intoned or tuned, or amps that sound like ass, or stuff that fritz'-out and breaks down.... it's like buying cheap tools. I've got great gear and great tools.... and when I put my wrench on something it doesn't slip and chew the heads off bolts --- I'm a shitty mechanic but my tools wont fuck up your engine - my lack of skill will.  Bad music gear is the same.  Don't believe me? Go to a local blues jam and put an old peavey bandit on the stage and watch shitty players and seasoned pros sound like the same ass.  Gear matters.

I think that's only true to an extent.  You can't put a Hamer in the hands of a kid just starting and he'll sound like Jeff Golub or any of the great Hamer players over the years.  

I think the seasoned pros will likely set a better tone on the Bandit, unless you let the shitty player set the tone and everyone has to use that tone.   No, that will not sound like a Marshall/Fender/Dumble/fill in the blank.  No matter what gear you use, with a crazy pedalboard or what have you, if it all falls down and you only have a guitar and an amp, I think the player will sound like the player.  

 

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13 minutes ago, scottcald said:

I think that's only true to an extent.  You can't put a Hamer in the hands of a kid just starting and he'll sound like Jeff Golub or any of the great Hamer players over the years.  

But the kid will have more fun playing when it listens to a better tone played by himself. And, better equipment creates the nuances the kid acknowledges when it plays the tone or chord right or wrong.

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Before EVH, if anyone suggested a professional player use guitars assembled with throwaway parts, they'd have been scoffed at.  Yet, he overcame the limitations of that.  I'm not saying there's no role, just that it's a part and another part is letting it hamper you.  

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The psychology of new 'gear' is identical to the psychology of new golf clubs - the "physics" behind the game doesn't change, but your mindset changes vastly with new equipment.  You 'feel' inspired, and that can break a boundary that allows you to progress and find something new/interesting with your playing.  That, alone, is sound motivation to open your wallet when you find something awesome you 'just gotta have'....at least it works with most people.

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8 hours ago, scottcald said:

Before EVH, if anyone suggested a professional player use guitars assembled with throwaway parts, they'd have been scoffed at.  Yet, he overcame the limitations of that.  I'm not saying there's no role, just that it's a part and another part is letting it hamper you.  

I wonder EVH had used Chinese made OEM parts at the time.

However, before EVH Brian May had mastered the assembly of throw away parts making up a guitar for about 5 quit or so.

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