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1 minute ago, Steve Haynie said:

The seller was asked if the neck thickness is thin or medium.  He said medium. 

It's always medium, feels great to me, fits in my hand perfectly, etc.

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1993 was that transition year from thin necks to the fuller necks. 

The guitar is three hours away.  It is tempting to drive up there with cash, but way too many people harass sellers online.  To ask, "Can I come over to try out your guitar?" is that question that makes sellers feel uneasy, but with my 1992 and 1993 Specials not getting played as much as the other guitars with thicker necks I really want to know what that Special FM is like. 

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As with my "Conundrum" post of a couple of months ago, true definitions of the typical descriptors are completely up to the seller.  '59 carve, vintage carve, slim taper, all mean something to somebody, but are inconsistently applied.  I have passed on a lot of guitars over the past ten years (ever since the hand cramping issues developed) just because the buyer couldn't be troubled to provide a neck measurement. 

I don't get mad or aggravated at the buyers, it's their prerogative, I just move along.

It's great that some outlets are in the habit: Dave's, Guitar Chimp, Wildwood, etc.  I tend to follow those.

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17 minutes ago, Steve Haynie said:

1993 was that transition year from thin necks to the fuller necks.

I mean that the answer to the question, "What is the neck size like?" is always one of the three that I mentioned, regardless of the actual dimensions.

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I measure necks, I have a whole catalog. Guitars I've owned, had access too, I've gone into stores to measure, grab measurements from CME, Dave's, Wildwood, whoever on Reverb. Why, well I "know" what's what when a guitar pops up. This doesn't tell me about "shape and feel" of the profile, but at least it's a start.

Yeah, geek; but my left arm had to be rebuilt after motorcycling roadracing abuse and after this the size and profile became really critical. As much as I loved Guitar X, Y or Z, I couldn't play them anymore so they got sold and I started the great hunt for necks/profiles that worked for me. Here are my Hamer's and a few I've picked up and one for fun!

 

'81 Special - 1.61 nut, 0.79 at the 1st and 0.85 at the 12th

'91 Sunburst - 1.67  0.835 at the 1st to 0.856 at the 12th

'92 Sunburst and '93 FM - 1.67, 0.795 1st and 0.8275 12th - early '90s Hamer thin, hell YEAH!

Other Hamers:

'86 TLE 1.65, 0.81 and 0.84

'87 Steve Stevens 1.64/R2, 0.808 and 0.838

'93 P-90 GT 1.67, 0.83 and 0.88

For fun:

'93 PRS CE-24 - 1.68, 0.784 and 0.852 (getting re-fretted as we speak!)

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5 hours ago, Steve Haynie said:

The seller was asked if the neck thickness is thin or medium.  He said medium. 

Did the seller say anything about it’s acoustic voice? 🙂

Seriously, that top is nice.  Reminds me of Mike C’s Special FM, which caused me to audibly gasp when he opened the case.

Someone please buy it before I do something stupid.

 

 

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3 hours ago, Toadroller said:

Arright; I'll reveal my ignorance and ask to be educated.

What are the measurement boundaries.  Back of the neck to.. top of fretboard?  Top of fret?

Convention is a measurement of the cross-section, excluding the fret, measured at the first fret and the twelfth fret. It’s not the be-all-to-end-all, but can serve as useful information if one has a preference. My personal preference is the Hamer Vintage Carve / Gibson 50’s Carve that is right at 0.90” thick at the first fret. 

Edited by velorush
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13 hours ago, velorush said:

Convention is a measurement of the cross-section, excluding the fret, measured at the first fret and the twelfth fret. It’s not the be-all-to-end-all, but can serve as useful information if one has a preference. My personal preference is the Hamer Vintage Carve / Gibson 50’s Carve that is right at 0.90” thick at the first fret. 

I`ve played the Gibson 60`s slim taper and really don`t like that one. I really like the 1959 round c shape on LP`s, but it didn`t feel as thick as .90  I believe the 1958 is thicker and closer to that measurement maybe? Thank you.

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5 minutes ago, black magic said:

I`ve played the Gibson 60`s slim taper and really don`t like that one. I really like the 1959 round c shape on LP`s, but it didn`t feel as thick as .90  I believe the 1958 is thicker and closer to that measurement maybe? Thank you.

That was the whole diatribe / rant in my "Conundrum" post earlier this month (or was it last?).  [In summary:] I have a Gibson (Howard Roberts Fusion) marketed (by Gibson) as having the "'59 Carve."  One of the best playing guitars I've ever picked up.  I've owned it since new (coming up on 30 years) and have never had occasion to measure the neck, but I just knew it had to be around my magic 0.90" spec as it has never caused me hand cramps, and after all, "it's the '59 carve!"  I had the strings off putting the original "fingers" tailpiece back on after an extended experiment with a trapeze, so I measured the neck - 0.81" at the first fret!  Yet no hand cramps! 

My conclusion (after many years espousing the contrary) is that there's more to the hand cramping issue than mere cross sectional girth.

All that said, the neck on the '96 Special FM (I posted about, above) was a fantastic medium.  I didn't have opportunity to measure it, but I'd guess somewhere around 0.83"-ish (very similar to the ubiquitous Fender "Modern C") and from what I understand, typical of the thicker '93-on Hamers referred to in this thread.

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2 hours ago, velorush said:

That was the whole diatribe / rant in my "Conundrum" post earlier this month (or was it last?).  [In summary:] I have a Gibson (Howard Roberts Fusion) marketed (by Gibson) as having the "'59 Carve."  One of the best playing guitars I've ever picked up.  I've owned it since new (coming up on 30 years) and have never had occasion to measure the neck, but I just knew it had to be around my magic 0.90" spec as it has never caused me hand cramps, and after all, "it's the '59 carve!"  I had the strings off putting the original "fingers" tailpiece back on after an extended experiment with a trapeze, so I measured the neck - 0.81" at the first fret!  Yet no hand cramps! 

My conclusion (after many years espousing the contrary) is that there's more to the hand cramping issue than mere cross sectional girth.

All that said, the neck on the '96 Special FM (I posted about, above) was a fantastic medium.  I didn't have opportunity to measure it, but I'd guess somewhere around 0.83"-ish (very similar to the ubiquitous Fender "Modern C") and from what I understand, typical of the thicker '93-on Hamers referred to in this thread.

Agreed, profile type matter quite a bit too. I find "most" to be C or D which I can deal with so I don't worry too much, but a V, asymmetrical, flattened D, U, heavy shoulders, overly rolled; forget about it! 

For me the measurements are the start of the discussion, but I know not to even bother with a endless list of guitars (types, ages, models) because of the measurements. And how I wish it were not that way!!!

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On 10/28/2020 at 6:13 AM, velorush said:

Those are such great guitars.  Had the Kiz Senior not come available soon after I bought mine I'd still have it.  

2Ahv8eU.jpg

Gorgeous!  What year is this one?

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8 hours ago, HamerCustomEr said:

Gorgeous!  What year is this one?

That's from 1996. 

qnfWit3.jpg

The (formerly @Punkavenger) Special FM now resides in Germany with @capridriver.  He had it wired up with a scorching  Rio Grande Muy Grande in the bridge (with coil split) and a Rio Grande Genuine Texas in the neck.  It exported with a nice set of PRS pickups and I put the Genuine Texas in the bridge of the Kiz' Senior (and a Buffalo Bucker in the neck).  The FM also had Schaller locking tuners someone (maybe @Punkavenger?) had imported from Germany through no small amount of effort (they were not available in the US at the time).

mZ9mI5M.jpg

A really spectacular guitar.

Incidentally, the building in the photos was a former dry goods store from the late 1800's.  It was torn down about six months after the photos to make room for a new FEMA storm shelter building (as an aside, the FEMA building can shelter around 500 people, but cost enough to put an in-ground shelter in every other backyard in the entire town).

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On 10/29/2020 at 1:06 PM, velorush said:

That was the whole diatribe / rant in my "Conundrum" post earlier this month (or was it last?).  [In summary:] I have a Gibson (Howard Roberts Fusion) marketed (by Gibson) as having the "'59 Carve."  One of the best playing guitars I've ever picked up.  I've owned it since new (coming up on 30 years) and have never had occasion to measure the neck, but I just knew it had to be around my magic 0.90" spec as it has never caused me hand cramps, and after all, "it's the '59 carve!"  I had the strings off putting the original "fingers" tailpiece back on after an extended experiment with a trapeze, so I measured the neck - 0.81" at the first fret!  Yet no hand cramps! 

My conclusion (after many years espousing the contrary) is that there's more to the hand cramping issue than mere cross sectional girth.

All that said, the neck on the '96 Special FM (I posted about, above) was a fantastic medium.  I didn't have opportunity to measure it, but I'd guess somewhere around 0.83"-ish (very similar to the ubiquitous Fender "Modern C") and from what I understand, typical of the thicker '93-on Hamers referred to in this thread.

I totally agree. My 2003 Studio custom neck is fantastic. I never measured, but definitely a medium C neck like most late 1993 necks were. I have a Carvin with their Holdsworth neck profile(.810) and love it. My Carvin and Hamer are very similar C necks in feel. 

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  • 3 weeks later...

I've found that, while thickness can be an issue for me at the extremes, profile is more important.  In particular, thin-ish "D" profile necks are an instant non-starter.  I picked up an Epi 335 with a heel repair for peanuts.  It had that skinny D profile and the shoulder hit me on the first knuckle of the first finger exactly wrong.  In minutes it became painful and in an hour it was back at the shop.

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