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TDC - Howard Dumble


LucSulla

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4 hours ago, beezerboy said:

my question is.... what happens to those guys that plunked down 30k for him to start the build?

That was my first thought too. He probably had a lot 'in the works'. As far I know, that was normal. If he didn't make proper arrangements, there's gonna be some interesting legal issues arising.

I knew a guy that had several, including some giant power amps he had made for maybe the Fillmore or Winterland, one of those late 60's early 70's famous clubs. The guitar amps sounded very nice. 'Worth' is relative.

 

 

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On 1/18/2022 at 1:10 PM, JGale said:

At least we still have Andy Fuchs.

I've thought about getting a Fuchs, but honestly like with the Dumble amps, I'm never quite sure how they "work". I remember reading that the magic of the Dumble ODS was in the Parallel preamp circuits, and the "Ratio" control, but I don't recall seeing something like that on the Fuchs amps.  Unless they named it something else. Still would love to get some time to really mess with a Fuchs ODS. So much more nuance than the CRANK THE HELL OUT OF IT strategy for early Marshall amps.

22 hours ago, django49 said:

Good to know. So many conflicting stories over the years.

One thing that seems a constant is that Marshall, Mesa, Dumble (and numerous others!) all found inspiration from one or another Fender amp for at least their early offerings. With the Bassman being frequently cited as a jump off point.

And don't forget that as Mesa Boogie got off the ground, it left room in the modding market for others, such as Paul Rivera, who started out doing mods to Deluxe Reverbs for the LA Studio players. Dumble decided early on that he wanted to be a small one man shop. Rivera is a well-known name, but they are still relatively small as well, making some great amps for players.

And dangit now I want a Fuchs ODS classic again, even though I don't really know how to use one.

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FWIW (at least what works for ME) think of it more like a Mesa than a Marshall. Turning all the EQ knobs to 10 is NOT the way to go. I would start with the 3 tone knobs at noon (half way) then tweak to see how they interact. With Mesa, for example, the treble is the first and most powerful, setting the stage for all else. And too much bass in the preamp section is not good. (Think how the typical Mesa EQ, POST preamp, tends to add back bass in the classic setting).

My own experience with Fuchs is that there is a 2 knob OD section. Which I understand to be the basis for the Dumbles.....One to set the amount of gain, the second to determine how much of the OD signal to add to the "clean" signal. So it is sort of a 1 1/2 channel amp. And (IMO) you want to have a fair amount of gain in the "clean" signal to get to the sounds you want. Then, build upon that.

Let me add that I have never touched an actual Dumble. But I have played multiple "clones" including Fuchs and do appreciate them. Or go the cheaper route and use the "right" pedal, my preference being the Ethos Overdrive.....It also needs a lot of tweaking to find YOUR tones. But once you do......

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22 minutes ago, django49 said:

Let me add that I have never touched an actual Dumble. But I have played multiple "clones" including Fuchs and do appreciate them. Or go the cheaper route and use the "right" pedal, my preference being the Ethos Overdrive.....It also needs a lot of tweaking to find YOUR tones. But once you do......

Yeah. The Fuchs would probably be what I would go for, seeing as live 35 minutes from Fuchs. I am planning to take my 1993 Rivera R55 there to see if they can make it less noisy, as I think the caps may need replacement.

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9 hours ago, tbonesullivan said:

I've thought about getting a Fuchs, but honestly like with the Dumble amps, I'm never quite sure how they "work". I remember reading that the magic of the Dumble ODS was in the Parallel preamp circuits, and the "Ratio" control, but I don't recall seeing something like that on the Fuchs amp

I’ve seen the schematics of two ODS’s and neither had parallel preamp stages. That doesn’t mean that there isn’t one or more out there with parallel stages. What seems to be the standard ODS topology is pretty much a Fenderish clean preamp that goes into a master volume output section with a two gain stage overdrive section that gets switched in between the clean volume and the master volume. The OD level control controls how much the first OD stage drives the second OD stage. The Ratio control is the output volume of the OD circuit. The control names are misleading and were eventually changed to Drive and Volume. Also, the Accent knob is nothing more than a presence control. 
 

The way I approach it is to set the tone controls and presence at noon. Select the clean channel and adjust the clean volume and master to taste. Adjust the tone controls to get the clean sound you want. Switch to the OD “channel” and adjust the drive control to get the amount of gain you want and used the ratio/volume control to adjust the OD volume in relation to the clean volume. If you have the OD on you basically have 3 gain controls ( clean vol, OD drive, Ratio/OD volume) and a master volume that are interactive and can create a myriad of clean to metal tones. 
 

The HRM ODS is basically the same topology but there’s a Marshall style tone stack (internal trim pots) at the end of the OD circuit and iirc, the front panel tonestack is disabled when in OD mode.  

Dumble was a fantastic designer who created an even-now modern amp by improving on classic tube circuits. 

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I have two Brown Note "D'Lite" amps.  They are exact replicas of two fairly well known Dumble Overdrive Special amps in Northern California.  One has the HRM circuit (separate tone controls for the lead channel under the hood) and one does not.  They are fantastic amps, but with lower output power.  

Dumble amps are, without a doubt, killer sounding.  And they strike jealousy in the hearts of great players and pretenders around the world.  SRV, Robben Ford and Larry Carlton are exemplary of the fact that they are the best amp for "that sound".  Frankly, I'm enamored with my Hermida ZenDrive and my Ethos pedal.  They approximate that sound.

I'm not a fan of disparaging a guy that made a living building one amp at a time and selling them for more than your car is worth.  Some might find a hint of "corksniffery" to the amps, but nobody can deny that they are fantastic sounding.  If it's not your cup of tea, this isn't the time to scoff at their value that is determined by their tone and consistency.  Dumble amps will maintain or exceed their present values.  And there won't be any more.  I'm reminded of Trainwreck amps....

Listen to Robben Ford's "Talk to Your Daughter" album.  Then tell me there's nothing to it.

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A shot I took at a small private event with one of the most boring guitarists I’ve ever seen perform.

 

 

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4 hours ago, cmatthes said:

A shot I took at a small private event with one of the most boring guitarists I’ve ever seen perform.

 

 

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Didn't expect  Brent having two Dumbles at once in his man-cave.

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18 hours ago, The Shark said:

I'm not a fan of disparaging a guy that made a living building one amp at a time and selling them for more than your car is worth.  Some might find a hint of "corksniffery" to the amps, but nobody can deny that they are fantastic sounding.  If it's not your cup of tea, this isn't the time to scoff at their value that is determined by their tone and consistency.  Dumble amps will maintain or exceed their present values.  And there won't be any more.  I'm reminded of Trainwreck amps....

Listen to Robben Ford's "Talk to Your Daughter" album.  Then tell me there's nothing to it.

Point taken. My PT Barnum comment was aimed not at Dumble's original clientele, but the secondary market collectors who have created the six-figure prices we've seen over the last several years. The ODS amps he designed/built sound killer for leads. It's a great sound; one of many sweet sounds made by various great amps.  The clones seem to nail the design concept, so there are options out there in the market for much less cash.  I've also played an Ethos Overdrive through a Boogie Thiele cab, and it seemed to deliver the goods, as well. I guess I'll never share the same pyschological territory with collectors.  To each, his own.

FWIW, I'm not that impressed by how they sound on chorded rhythms, therefore I'd never says it's THE sound, but def one of the best lead tones I've ever heard from an amp.  As for Robben's TtYD album. I listened to it this afternoon; it's a good demo of the Dumble tone. But to my ears, nearly any of Larry Carlton's overdriven fills and solos or David Lindley's solos are even better examples of the ODS tone.  The whole tonal concept of note "bloom" is farily evident with those two players. 

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10 minutes ago, The Shark said:

Carlos?

Yeah - Beyond a snoozefest. Buddy Guy blew him off the stage.

 

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6 minutes ago, RobB said:

What other douche would have a picture of Sri Chinmoy on his $60,000 Dumble?

I noticed that and what appear to be paisley tolex covered PRS cabs off to the sides.

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3 hours ago, cmatthes said:

Yeah - Beyond a snoozefest. Buddy Guy blew him off the stage.

 

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I've seen him four times.  He was fantastic once.  The Zebop tour was great.  Every show after that, I was ready to leave before the crowd.  I won't spend another dime.  

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