Early Dimarzio PAFs

[wil50n]

How different are the 1972/73 Dimarzio PAFs to the Hamer-spec Dimarzio PAFs of 1977 ? And in general, what are the characteristics of the early Dimarzio PAFS ?

On a side note when trying to find ANY info about them, I found this post with an early Sunburst with a very different bridge and control arrangement

https://www.everythingsg.com/threads/early-dimarzio-paf-replicas.6656/?fbclid=IwAR1qbsALDPDlP_ct42e2GelQyAm9Q6BZl0yN7KpwQP5UFM1dGHixKyfKKbI

[Hbom]

I really don't know.

But here's some discussion on the subject from a while back. I hope it helps. 

I also hope Hamer Dave, zenmindbeginner, Serial, Disturber, Andrew, FrankieIII and Jaberwock don't mind this being posted again.

 

Answers to a question by Hamer Dave about the history of Di Marzio pickups April 24 2012

 zenmindbeginner    Posted April 24, 2012

DP103 was introduced in 1974. Basically custom orders for friends of Larry and limited production runs throughout the year.

The earliest 1974 models had unstamped brass baseplates and sometime during the year DiMarzio adopted a "DIMARZIO PICKUPS" stamp that they used on the baseplate throughout 1975 and into 1976.

All 1975 and earlier DP103s had long legs and braided one conductor cable and the aforementioned stamp.

Sometime in 1976 or 1977, short legs and black coaxial two conductor cable appeared. DiMarzio also switched to the present "DIMARZIO PICKUPS MADE IN THE USA"

Hamers made in '77 and '78 have these early DP103s that had the new logo stamp, short legs and 2 conductor cable.

Sometime in 1980 or 1981, the feet changed from square to triangular.

The Super Distortion went through similar changes although it is still being made today and is the same pickup... you can apply the logo stamp, feet and conductor changes of the DP103 to the DP100.

DiMarzio doesn't make the DP103 anymore... the 36th Anniversary PAF replaced it and is a different pickup even though the materials and DC resistance are nearly identical. The coating on the wire is probably different... the neck and bridge models are also wound differently today and the earlier DP103s had very similarly wound necks and bridges. Here is a DP103 in it's last incarnation with the new flush slugs with the circular markings on them (appeared sometime in the 90's, I'm kind of foggy on what actual year). The slugs started out as sort of concave and went to flat sometime in the early 80's and then changed to a different slug alloy all together with a tighter and more flush fit.

Serial Posted April 24, 2012

I think you're off by a year or two. Braided leads remained until early 1979 on Hamers that I've seen. Plastic wrapped leads (grey or black) appear mixed with braided leads in Sunbursts (one pickup each on my mid-1979 one). You have the right years for the large "Dimarzio Pickups" stamp. There was a year (78-79) with the braided leads and smaller logo with "Made in USA" I believe. Been a while since I've consulted my stuff on that(!).

Beveled edge slugs remained until 1982/83, then flat topped slugs until 85 or so when the slugs are flat and appear milled. At least this is true for Hamer Slammers. Earliest Slammers have the beveled slug mags and "Hamer Guitars" stamp.

I'll have to look at my 76 Standard again-been years since I looked under the hood, but I think that both pickups were short legged. Not 100% by any means, but one of the pickups has Gibson coils and a Dimarzio baseplate.

Disturber Posted April 25, 2012

The PAF and Superdistortion were both un-potted in the beginning as well. I don't know when they started potting their pups, anyone know?

I've had early Superdistortions and Super 2's were the magnets were sittting in white residue on the baseplate, a big white shunk of some rubber like paste. It was not sticky, but probably was when applied - then dried quite quickly. The magnets on these pups are not possible to change unless you unscrew both bobbins and use a screwdriver or similar to bend the magnet loose. The bobbins are also sitting glued to this residue.

The Dimarzio pafs in my 1986 Sunburst both seem un-potted. So I guess they started potting their pafs quite late. The Superdistortions probably a lot earlier.

Andrew Posted April 25, 2012

Brilliant history! Never seen a long leg DMZ.

But missed the way that in the 90s they switched the plastic coils from 3 little holes (for the hook-up wire and base screws) to just the two for the base screws. Check your newer pickups and you will see the outer hole has gone! The one above is a bit weird with a 2 and a 3 small hole coil.

I also think that the slugs (flat, not domed) increased in diameter very slightly in 83 or 84.

Andrew Posted April 25, 2012

We missed that during the 1980s they kept swapping between black and clear tape on the bobbins in a pattern I have never made sense of.

Disturber Posted April 26, 2012

I've seen some Dimarzios from around 1980-ish with a grey plastic conductor cable. Is the grey cable original, and was it only used during a limited time, or only on OEM versions, or what?

Any one know, or have seen this grey plastic cable I'm talking about?

Disturber Posted April 26, 2012

  On ‎4‎/‎26‎/‎2012 at 6:32 AM, sonic1974 said: So with these changes, did the sound of the pickups change a lot through the years?

 

Not so much from the late 70's to early/mid 80's that I've tried. I have never swapped 'em out in the same guitar so I can't say for 100%, but the sound characteristics are the same in the different guitars I've had them in - great that is.

 

FrankieIII Posted May 6, 2012

PAF = slugs/slot

Dual Sound = hex/hex

Super Distortion = hex/hex

 

Disturber Posted August 26, 2014

  On ‎8‎/‎26‎/‎2014 at 7:17 PM, jaberwock said:

  On ‎8‎/‎26‎/‎2014 at 5:38 AM, Disturber said:

  On ‎8‎/‎20‎/‎2014 at 10:33 PM, jaberwock said:

I bought this in the UK in 1977, 7.3K, very bright, microphonic, so I'm assuming its unpotted; sounds almost like a Tele in the bridge position of a Les Paul.

They can be very bright in some guitars. Changing the mags to A2 works miracles in such cases. They sound heavenly then.

edit: Just save the original mags so you can put them back to stock. Old Dimarzio's are worth taking care of.

So the originals had Alnico 5 magnets.......... this pickup sounds great in the neck position; I hadn't used it in thirty years, I don't remember it being that bright before...........some natural weakening of the magnets perhaps ?

Originals have A5's. Kinda half polished. One side usually is very rough, the other more polished. Some magnets are very black, some more brown-ish. They used very good magnets in the 70's and (up to mid/late?) 80's. I don't know what they are using now. Not from the same source for sure, but them might still be good....

Dimarzio PAF's have had a rumour, at least among LP players, to be bright. I think the maple top makes the difference compared to the old Hamer's.

10-15 years ago your could buy these old Dimarzio for next to nothing. But I think it has caught up some on how great they can sound in the right guitar. Prices have gone up a lot on ebay.

I have the older ones in most of my humbucker guitars. They sound killer for the most part, but they are always on the bright side, lots of bite. They can be hard to dial in right - height adjustment and screw pole height - each mm difference can make a change in how trebly they are.

On some guitars the neck needs the screw poles set high, to give it more bite and treble. And on most bridge pups I keep the screw poled in line with the bobbin. But on one guitar I've had to keep the bass side close to the strings, screw poles down, and the treble side lower, screw poles up, to get the right balance. Screws are kinda in line, but the bobbin is lower on the treble side.

It's all in the interaction with how the guitar sounds and resonates, and the pickup. As these are now +-30 years old, and un-potted, they can be slightly microphonic and very sensetive to what they pick up. That is why they take some tweaking to get right.

They are night and day compared modern over potted Duncans that gives much less response when you tweak the screw pole height.

And in two guitars, one with a thick maple cap, they were very ice picky and impossible to get a good sound out of. Weak, no omph through the amp etc. I then changed the mags to A2's, and it's like night and day. These two guitars now sound totally awesome.

The good thing with Seymour Duncan is that you can order almost anything. You want an un-potted '59. They'll make it for you. Dimarzio, very different company. I tried to order a set of un-potted 36 Anniversarys. They totally refused to make them for me. It's a shame, I would love to try a pair.

Disturber Posted August 28, 2014

  On ‎8‎/‎27‎/‎2014 at 7:43 PM, jaberwock said:

I was considering buying a pair of Wolfetone, or WCR humbuckers, as they seem to get so much love on this forum, but I'll try some A2 magnets in the DMZ first; will that drop the output ? because it's a pretty low as it is.

Thanks Jaberwock

Don't think you'll perceive it as that they drop the output, even if they do. The pup will response in a more compressed way, so it might just feel like the output has increased. It will most probably sound tighter, and a little more "rude". Try it. It's easily reversable. Takes 5 minutes to swap a mag.

 

 

[wil50n]

Thanks Hbom, a great summary.

I'm watching a pair for sale that are listed as '72/3, but they have Dimarzio Pickups stamped on the baseplate

[cmatthes]

Then they’re not from 1972/73! 😉