Hamer Newport Pro Vs 335, 535, AS2200, etc

[tbonesullivan]

So, I couldn't find a topic on this, so I made one. Basically, I'm wondering how the Newport Pro stacks up against the competition from Yamaha, Gibson, Heritage, etc. I eventually will get a semi-hollow, and I want to get the most bang for my buck, but also end up with a top class instrument. I know asking here will get some pretty biased opinions, but the Newport Pro is currently the favorite anyway, and I'd like to hear from those who actually have them.

One thing I'm really curious about is how the Spruce top affects sound as compared to the laminated or carved maple that other makers use. Also the seth lover pickups are something I've never dealt with.

[Sam]

I don't have a Pro, though I've got a regular spruce version fitted with buckers. I've also got a maple topped Newport to compare with my SA1000. The first point to stress is that Newports (in any configuration) don't sound much like 335s. The 'ports have an open acoustic quality that is far less compressed (less punch and sustain too). I'm not particularly keen on the sound of the spruce newport when overdriven, as it's seems better suited to chimey/jazzy cleans. On the other hand, the maple topped Newport has more punch and sustain - though retains a bitey (Gretschy) snarl even when fitted with buckers.

If you want that distinctive complex 335 overdriven sound you won't find it in a Newport (or CS-336 for that matter.) I'm super pleased with my Yamaha SA - it replaced a '95 335 reissue that I had for the best part of a decade. Amazing quality, and they can still be snapped up for relatively few $$$.

[tbonesullivan]

Thanks for the input! I'm definitely looking for a rock guitar... and not a jazz guitar. I don't want to play metal on it but I'm looking for something with bite. I have heard very good things about the Yamaha SA series, and also I wouldn't have much trouble finding a reasonably priced heritage 535.

Or, I could track down a Maple Topped newport.

Or just forget about semi-hollows and start hording hamer specials from the 90s.

[JohnnyB]

Thanks for the input! I'm definitely looking for a rock guitar... and not a jazz guitar. I don't want to play metal on it but I'm looking for something with bite. I have heard very good things about the Yamaha SA series, and also I wouldn't have much trouble finding a reasonably priced heritage 535.

Another great candidate in the mold of the Yamaha SA series is the short-lived Ibanez AS180. It's very much like a Gibson Dot ES-335 but with slightly different shaped cutaway horns. These were made in the Hammamatsu plant in Japan and listed at $1500 about 11 years ago. The workmanship and sunburst are beautifully done.

Here's a data sheet w/pics. I have one as well as a spruce/Phat Cat Newport. The stock pickups are alnico, but no great shakes. I have a Duncan Jazz at the neck and a '59 at the bridge. At the time I was going for a clear jazz tone, but if I were to do it today it would probably be Fralins, a Rio Grande Texas/BBQ combo, or Gibson Classic '57s. Having played Pesocaster's PesoPro, I'd probably go for the Rio Grandes.

Ibanez still makes a guitar like this in the Scofield model, but it has figured maple, big block fretmarkers, an ebony board, and is much more expensive. If you can find an AS180 at all, it will probably be under $700 (I think).

[tbonesullivan]

NICE!!! the big problem of course is finding an Yammy AS1000 or Ibanez AS180. I have looked for the AS180 before, and rarely seen one. The current model Yamaha AS2200 and the Heritage 535's are much easier to track down. It's a shame I wasn't in the market when my friend moved his blue Heritage 535... I love blue guitars.

[JohnnyB]

NICE!!! the big problem of course is finding an Yammy AS1000 or Ibanez AS180. I have looked for the AS180 before, and rarely seen one. The current model Yamaha AS2200 and the Heritage 535's are much easier to track down. It's a shame I wasn't in the market when my friend moved his blue Heritage 535... I love blue guitars.

Oh, that reminds me. I live within a mile of a really good guitar store which carried Heritage a few years ago. I've played a few Heritages that were pretty exquisite, such as their Johnny Smith model. But for my money, I'd take my AS180 any day of the week over a Heritage 535. I like the refinement, fit, & finish of the Ibanez much better. The 535 can rock just as hard; the AS180 just felt better in my hands. But as you say, they don't grow on trees. There are probably more AS200's and Scofields out there. The AS200 was what Scofield played before they made his signature model.

[Sam]

Good price going on this SA2200:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Hollow-body-Electric-G...id=p3286.c0.m14

[tbonesullivan]

hmm... what about this:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=260463984563

[GaryT]

Well you guys have seen my Birdseye Maple-Top Newport Pro I recently posted. I also own a TO Spruce Top NP, and have owned a 2002 Gibson 335 and MIJ Ibanez Artists including the 200, 180 I believe the other was. All nice guitars but my new Maple-Top Newport is just an amazing axe. Instant LOVE with Incredible Quality and Craftsmanship.

IMHO the current Newport Pro Maple body/Mahogany neck with the Seths is by far the NICEST. Collins would be an equiv. IMHO.

BTW the one I always wanted to and haven't owned yet is the Yamaha SA-2200. Another worthy Semi, and the East Coast Guilds. Just Sayin.

[tbonesullivan]

Well.. I've decided against the Sheraton, and now I'm back with basically the SA2200, the Heritage 535, and the Newport Pro. I read more reviews, and also realized that I'm not getting the guitar to play hard rock.. I'm getting it to play classic rock and some clean stuff. I've got plenty of solid bodies to handle the heavy loud stuff.

So... now to stalk guitars on ebay.

[RobB]

Well.. I've decided against the Sheraton, and now I'm back with basically the SA2200, the Heritage 535, and the Newport Pro.

I don't think you can go wrong with the Yamaha SA series. Their high-end stuff is really nicely made. I've only played a Newport 12, so I can't really comment on a Newport Pro, but I would get the SA over a Heritage, any day.

Damn! Curse my genetics! @ 5'7", 335's are way too huge for me to play with a straight face. I had a Heritage Roy Clark which was a beauty but just too BIG. I love Yamaha/Ibanez semi-solids but just can't get widdem...

For some reason, though, my Gretsch Chet Atkins Tennessean feels/looks great. Bigger body, but slimmer hips?

[3of5]

You may want to check out the Epiphone Elitist Dot 335. Made in Japan, discontinued last year. Outstanding construction. I have one. Sounds, looks and is constructed like a good Gibson 335. The stock pickups are Gibsons that have been renumbered to hide the fact that they are same as on the real thing. Poly finish vs. nitro. I don't play it anymore because I like my Newport better and because the large size hurts my poor old shoulder after about 20 minutes.

[JohnnyB]

Given the various alternatives mentioned here, I suspect the Yamaha SA2200 is the smartest buy of the bunch. Its construction is like the Ibanez Scofield/AS200 with flame maple and ebony board. But they're more plentiful. Even used Scofields go for around $2K, and while an AS180 may come in at $800 or under, good luck finding one. But it doesn't seem hard at all to find a Yamaha SA2200 for $800 or less, with the wood quality and appointments of a $2K Ibanez, and I'd think they're every bit as good. If they're built to the same standard as the Hammamatsu-made Ibanezes (and I'd think they are), they would indeed be more satisfying than a Heritage. Then put in the pickups that match the kinds of music you're going to play.

[Sam]

But it doesn't seem hard at all to find a Yamaha SA2200 for $800 or less

I watch the SA market pretty closely (ebay), and 2200s rarely sell below 1K unless they're heavily played examples.

[JohnnyB]

But it doesn't seem hard at all to find a Yamaha SA2200 for $800 or less

I watch the SA market pretty closely (ebay), and 2200s rarely sell below 1K unless they're heavily played examples.

Right you are. I don't know what I had just looked at when I wrote that. Maybe I was thinking of the SA2100, where you have some chance of a sub-$1K price. Looks like $1250 is about the target price for the SA2200.

Another candidates in this category would be the MIJ-era Aria Pro II ES-800.

[GaryT]

You don't see to many SA-2200 used either. And when you do they are around the $1200. mark.

My instant thoughts when thinking about ALL these Semis and Hollows is body construction. The idea of a Solid hard wood electric as opposed to a Laminated body IMO is a significant difference. I just feel the Newport, or a 336/356 is going to continue to sound better and better as time passes. [same theory with solid acoustics] The laminated could be a hit or miss.

When I bought my 335 I had played 6 different 335s at Sam Ash. A few were just out and out Dogs. dead-wood that sounded almost Dull instead of vibrant with great projection like I feel the NP is. Anyway thought I'd throw that out.

[tbonesullivan]

the solid spruce top is one thing that drew me to the newport pro in the first place. I kinda like going "against" the grain, which is one of the reasons it appeals to me. The construction would be top notch, and I like the colors they offer it in. I also like Heritage guitars, and the Yamaha stuff. Also there are some MIJ Epiphone sheratons up now that I've been looking at.

But... something about the hamer just looks better... maybe it's the strap button on the upper horn where it belongs instead of on the back of the neck joint. Also the black cherry burst and jazz burst look awesome.

[Guest pirateflynn]

I pretty much agree with Sam's observations. The heavy plywood top and tailpiece position on a 335 make it quite a bit different from a Newport Pro. I special ordered mine to bring it closer to a 335 but it's still acoustically much more responsive than a 335. I'd probably go witha Heritage 535 if I were still searching for one.

[Sam]

^ Yours is definitely the exception when making comparisons with 335s. I'd be most interested to compare the PiratePro with its closer rivals:

[Guest pirateflynn]

^ Yours is definitely the exception when making comparisons with 335s. I'd be most interested to compare the PiratePro with its closer rivals:

Yes, that would be fun!

photo by elduave

[JohnnyB]

I own a Newport and an Ibanez AS180. I have previously owned an Epiphone artist stock Casino (formerly owned by Chris Ballew of Presidents of the United States of America), a Gibson ES-335 Studio (no f-holes), and a Gibson ES-325 (mini-buckers, plastic control panel).

The Newport is simply a different animal altogether. Mine is a spruce top/Phat Cat, but all Newports are more nuanced and responsive than these other guitars. A Newport has a response more like a hand-made hollow archtop--not acoustically, but definitely electrically. It's like a scalpel, able to cut the sharpest delineations in tone and volume, adding up to overall expressivity. As such it's a good jazz guitar and the best blues guitar I've ever played, especially if you want a guitar to echo the vocals in a call-response style (e.g., BB King), as the Newport can create spookily expressive tonality shadings that suggest the human voice.

The 335-style constructed guitars (laminated maple, center block), are more like mallets. Like a scalpel, it's a very effective tool, but is meant to be used in another way. My Ibanez does put out a nice jazz sound with lots of that maple midrange "pop," but it's certainly no Johnny Smith jazz box. But crank that thing and overdrive a tube amp and it's pure classic rock'n'roll. One of my favorite tone combos is to play the AS180 into a 1965 Sears Silvertone 1482:

It screams, it howls, it sustains like a mo-fo. I'm sure I can get my Newport to drive it to something similar, but played clean or dirty the Newport has more tonal complexity, top end "air," and dynamic resolution. If you're looking for an ES-335, you'll need something constructed like an ES-335, with good PAF-style pickups swapped in.

I just came across some interesting Japanese alternatives. ESP has a model called the ESP Edwards E-SA-125LTS, which uses real Duncan pickups, and Tokai makes a series of them depending on trim level, including (but not limited to) the ES-60, ES-125, and ES-175. I've seen other models on eBay offered from Japanese or UK vendors--the ES-110 and ES-130.

[tbonesullivan]

Hmmm... currently lookin at this heritage 535, which has schaller pickups, and they are supposed to be very PAF sounding:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=270442514291

The sound I'm missing that I used to have came from a MIK Epiphone sheraton: my first guitar that I bought with my own money. It looks like, for that sound, the heritage 535 or Yamaha SA2200 is the best bet. Thanks for all the help. If these all fall through then I'll probably pick up a used Newport pro.

[JohnnyB]

Hmmm... currently lookin at this heritage 535, which has schaller pickups, and they are supposed to be very PAF sounding...

Don't believe everything you read.

EVERYTHING is "supposed to be very PAF sounding."

[tbonesullivan]

HAH! True. Well, that's the reason one of my friends who had two 535s at different times didn't like them. They were too "PAF" and not biting or modern enough. something like that. If I find this to be true, well then I'll just have to slap a pair of SD Pearly Gates in it.

[Guest pirateflynn]

If I find this to be true, well then I'll just have to slap a pair of SD Pearly Gates in it.

.. or you could just look for one with Seth's in it. They are out there.