Overseas Payment options...

[bobbymack]

I have an interested ebay buyer from Australia, he has very good feedback. But, it's an expensive item and I need to know I'm safe before I agree to ship to him.

What is the best way to get paid by an international buyer without getting hosed? Paypal? Western Union Wire Transfer? Bank transfer?

Help! I know it's been brought up before, but I never read the answers...

[BadgerDave]

Hmmm, does he want you to deliver it to Hawaii, by any chance?

Just yesterday I had an Australian buyer trying to twist my arm to accept PayPal or wire transfer and ship to Hawaii, where he claimed he had a gig on Oct. 5. He said that Western Union was too inconvenient and expensive. If this sounds familiar, you should be extra cautious.

I only accept Western Union for International sales. Even on expensive items, the maximum charge is $25.00 and there are thousands of W.U. locations all over the world. With Western Union, you get cash and there's no opportunity for a fraudulent buyer to reverse, revoke, chargeback or otherwise deprive you of the payment. PayPal charges can be challenged, Money Orders and Cashiers checks can be faked, and wire transfers can be reversed.

[raymund]

Hi ! I am also very interested in this topic - but experienced all the problems from the buyer´s side. I am Austrian citizen but living in Indonesia for the time being. When I saw a Hamer Studio Custom (worldwide sales offered) at ebay I registered at ebay to bid on it. When I asked for shipping costs to Indonesia I was immediately refused by the seller. Furthermore maybe half an hour after my registration (and this was really my first registration and experience with ebay as I never before in my life sold or bid on something) I was suspended by ebay for safety reasons and asked to send copies of my passport, legalized by a notary public. As I am not willing to accept all the hassles and costs to get a legalization of my passport I refrain from doing any deals on ebay. Therefore I am also not accepted by Paypal which is an ebay company. Similar stuff happened to me at the HFC. I was interested in one axe and immediately refused when I mentioned the axe should be shipped to Indonesia.

You also have to understand the risks from the buyer´s side. Nevertheless I definitely trust folks from the HFC more than any ebay seller and would accept payment in advance via bank transfer.

So my question is, why should there still be a safety problem if I transfer the requested amount from my Austrian bank account to an US bank account ?

P.S. A good way to distinguish between serious and fraudulent buyers who are in possession of a credit card is to ask them for a copy of their passports / ID sent by email attach and the address the credit card statements are sent to and to check with the credit card company. This address is usually only known to the real owner of the credit card.

[SirDouglas]

Unfort. for the HONEST people in Indonesia there are alot of scammers and CC fraud. This problem has been going on for qutie a few years and nearly no one selling high dollar musical instruments will sell to anyone from there or Singapore without getting cash in hand first, IF that.

Hell while I was stationed in Germany for the last few years Ive had a ton of problems getting guitars shipped there even WITH it being paid for in advance and being shipped to an APO address that was confirmed.

Sad to say that while 90% of us are honest folk that other 10% of people screw it up for the rest of us. I hope you get the guitar you want, maybe try sending it to Austria to your home there and then ship it to where your at. Will cost more in shipping but you will get the guitar you wanted.

Sir Douglas

Randy

[Submariner85]

I would be very careful about shipping to Australia. I sold a Dime 332 to some guy in Australia and ended up having to ship it with the neck removed for 76 dollars because with the neck attached, due to Australia's crazy package limitations USPS wanted 180 dollars, Fedex wanted 230 dollars and UPS wanted 300 to ship it.

If the buyer is willing to front that kinda money for shipping then go for it, otherwise you're gonna eat it.

As far as the fraud part. I think the best bet is Western Union.

[raymund]

Sir Douglas, thanks for the consoling words. Unfortunately shipping to Austria is also no solution as I only go once or twice per year back to my home country. And I will never forget my experience when I brought my main axe, a very sweet sounding Les Paul Standard Premium Plus, by plane to Indonesia. Despite the fact that the airline assured me to be allowed to bring the axe as hand luggage on board, suddenly at the airport I had to check it in. Believe me I was very reliefed when my LP showed up at the luggage carrousel in Jakarta airport undamaged (not even the case scratched).

[Guest teefus2]

For International buyers Western Union is the best way to go. You get the cash in hand before shipping the package off.

[JJ Paul]

...  PayPal charges can be challenged, Money Orders and Cashiers checks can be faked, and wire transfers can be reversed.

Lemme chime in from overseas and as an employee for a swiss bank.

Bank transfers CANNOT be reversed UNLESS the recipient agrees.

That is a fact - fortunately for the seller.

Once the money is gone the buyer better be sure where he sent the moola 'cause it's not said he can get it back if he/she has made a mistake.

JJ Paul

[luiss]

I bought some item from four HFC members and I payed by International transfer(two times) and paypal( two times too).It cost me cheaper going to paypal payment,but I choose bank transfer in the first two ocassions because I was foreign for all of them and I felt it safer for both.As Paul says a bank transfer cannot be reversed if receipt man does not gives OK......

[BadgerDave]

Let me clarify.

A legitimate bank wire transfer cannot be reversed by the sender. However, it is possible to falsify a wire transfer by supplying the receiving bank with false information. This takes a bit of sophistication, but it's well within the capability of a mid-level scammer.

Just because your bank receives a wire transfer and credits your account doesn't mean they won't reverse it if the transfer turns out to be from a non-existant account. If your bank can't collect, they'll remove the money from your account. It's similar to a bounced check.

If you accept a wire transfer and you are even slightly suspicious of the sender, wait until your bank verifies receipt of the funds before you ship.

[JJ Paul]

I am sorry to have to intervene another time, Dave.

Banks nowadays use a worldwide transfer network called SWIFT (Society for Worldwide Interbank Fund Transfer) which is completely electronic.

The system does NOT run on internet and cannot be hacked electronically.

Unless someone inside the issuing bank decides to commit a fraud - which will take at least other 2 accomplices to pull off correctly.

I always supply the TRN code of my outgoing SWIFT transfers so the receiving entity can track the incoming $$$ faster.

The only way one could try to scam the recieving bank isbe by sending a fax with forged code, but nowaday no self respecting bank would accept THAT as a proof of payment, since electronic verification is really a matter of minutes.

Pls excuse the long-ish explanation, BTW...

JJ

[Jem]

I'll second, or is it third, Bank Transfer's as being 100% secure - although i've never raised one on the Bank Of Indonesia (LoL...it's a joke duh !). Out of a dozen or so guitars i've brought from either the states or mainland Europe if the guy's the slightest bit jumpy i always offer a bank transfer which normally puts people right at rest. Tends to cost me around equivelent of $30 US and SOMETIMES may cost the guy at the other end $10'ish to get it out but on a $800 guitar who cares.

Jem.