1977 Sunburst Questions

[MN Hobbyist]

I've recently rediscovered my '77 Sunburst. Didn't know they were such a hot topic until I happened upon the HFC forum. It's not for sale. I play it all the time and haven't played a better guitar. I bought it in '94 and know nothing about previous owner or any mods done to it before I got it. I believe it has Seymour Duncan Seth Lover 55's in both positions. One of them, I put in to match the one that came with it. I have one of the original PU's, not installed, but it appears to be a Gibson Burstbucker, not a DiMarzio. The tuners, though Grovers, appear to be replacement ones because of the obvious holes in the back of the headstock. This guitar is very beat up and nicked but in perfect playing and sounding shape.

Anyways, I have some questions on it.

Specifically I'm wondering about the neck, bridge, and speed knobs. From what I've read, the earliest sunbursts with dot necks are supposed to have the octave dots both on the fingerboard and on the side of the neck be relatively far apart. Mine are close together, which makes more sense for 1979-80 models. In addition, the headstock is shorter, with a less pronounced lip shape, so it seems more like a newer model. Also the speed knobs are supposed to be black, but mine are gold. Were any of the 1977 sunbursts originally outfitted with gold speed knobs? Finally, the bridge does not have a shim under it but is solid metal with the sustain block, which supposedly didn't happen until later.

Any thoughts on what's original and what's not? Any idea how much this could fetch? Again, I'm not selling but would like to know out of curiosity.

Thanks in advance for any thoughts!

[cmatthes]

Tuners should probably be Grover Super Rotomatics (there's a NOS set of "Bullseyes" on eBay right now, actually, but they're tough to find typically).

Pickups would be DiMarzio pickups wound for Hamer - PAFs. An uncovered Zebra in the neck and a double cream in the bridge. The Burstbuckers didn't come along until around 20 years after that guitar left the Hamer shop.

#7 0034 is one of the really early ones - that's a great one to keep!! You have definitely seen a big appreciation in value on that one since you originally got it.

[hamerhead]

That's actually a shimmed bridge you got there. Somebody may have substituted a metal piece in place of the original rosewood or ebony shim.

Great looking guitar. I bet it plays pretty well, too.

[MN Hobbyist]

Thanks for the info. I imagine that those original pickups are pretty hard to come by, huh?

That's actually a shimmed bridge you got there. Somebody may have substituted a metal piece in place of the original rosewood or ebony shim.

Great looking guitar. I bet it plays pretty well, too.

Good eye on the shim. That makes sense. And yes, it does play well.

[Guest pirateflynn]

What's the neck carve like?

[MN Hobbyist]

What's the neck carve like?

I'm not sure what to compare it to, but I would say it's medium-to-chunky. To be exact the nut is 5cm wide and the neck is 33mm deep.

[serial]

Pickups are obviously not original-Ive seen gold knobs on 77s before, but it's hard to tell (and I doubt it matters) if they're original. Tuners have been replaced. Never seen a metal shim, but I don't see why they wouldn't have them. I've seen ebony, rosewood and black spray painted plastic shims.

The octave dots and side dots look strange though and Ive owned or spent a lot of time with a bunch of 77 Sunbursts (there are only 95-100 out there including the prototypes). I've never seen any that looked like that. They were done in small batches of 20 or so at a time so small variations could be possible. I'll have to check if I have any info on this one, bit I doubt it- Hamer doesn't have any records for the first few dozen Sunbursts.

Neck joint looks different too.

[Camstone]

I owned a '77 Sunburst from 1979 to 1981. My guitar did not have a shim under the bridge. The sustain block was solid metal to the face of the guitar. Like a current sustain block bridge. The pics below were both taken in 1979.

[flattop]

The headstock sure does look more like a 80/81 model with the less pronounced 'lip' ,shorter headstock.

Only saw this type on later than 79 models,new neck fitted perhaps?

5cm nut width? thats huge ,normally 4.2cm.

[BTMN]

Welcome! Nice guitar. Seen the info on the Minneapolis Jam? I'm figuring Mn means Minnesota that is.

[MN Hobbyist]

The headstock sure does look more like a 80/81 model with the less pronounced 'lip' ,shorter headstock.

Only saw this type on later than 79 models,new neck fitted perhaps?

5cm nut width? thats huge ,normally 4.2cm.

Oops yr right. I was mis-reading my measuring tape. It's 4.2cm.

If a new neck has been fitted, I wonder how the serial number was retained. I'm definitely no expert, but I see no evidence of major headstock repair (other than new tuners and nut). If anything I might guess that there was a neck break and it was sent to Hamer for repair, and Hamer gave it a new neck and restamped it with the old serial number. In support of this, you can see that the paint color in the join region between the neck and body is lighter. Maybe this is normal? No idea if the new neck theory is the case, just guessing. Did Hamer do major repair work on their guitars for the general public?

[MN Hobbyist]

I owned a '77 Sunburst from 1979 to 1981. My guitar did not have a shim under the bridge. The sustain block was solid metal to the face of the guitar. Like a current sustain block bridge. The pics below were both taken in 1979.

Too bad you don't have it anymore! It goes well with bell-bottoms, BTW.

Welcome! Nice guitar. Seen the info on the Minneapolis Jam? I'm figuring Mn means Minnesota that is.

Thanks. Yeah I'm in Mpls. Maybe I'll check it out. But I fear if I start getting too interested in this stuff I'll start wanting more Hamers and that will require more money... Common problem, I imagine.

[serial]

I can't see clearly enough on my iPhone, but if it's a 3 piece neck, it's been re-necked. Hamer used /of necks until mid 79. Rearamping the original serial is likely if it went to the factory. I can't tell, but if the tuners are smooth backed Grovers, they're correct for 77s too.

A lot of the early 1 pc necks twisted badly, so a warranty job would be likely Id guess.

[mirrorimij]

It could possibly be a re-neck. Hamer has done those from time to time and they would have retained the original serial number in the process.

Serial- did they use the same font for serial numbers in 77 as were used in the early 80's?

[bubs_42]

I love mine, sadly the other Sunburst don't get played as much... The necks are Fat and awsome. Mine has a repaired headstock but it plays great !

[serial]

I love mine, sadly the other Sunburst don't get played as much... The necks are Fat and awsome. Mine has a repaired headstock but it plays great !

I remember #0051 well-KILLER neck on that one! I had it for 8 years or do and had the original pickups in it-I thought they sounded amazing in there. The head repair was a lot uglier when I owned it- BCRGreg did a great job fixing the fix.

[bubs_42]

I love mine, sadly the other Sunburst don't get played as much... The necks are Fat and awsome. Mine has a repaired headstock but it plays great !

I remember #0051 well-KILLER neck on that one! I had it for 8 years or do and had the original pickups in it-I thought they sounded amazing in there. The head repair was a lot uglier when I owned it- BCRGreg did a great job fixing the fix.

The Original Pups were long gone, by the time I got it. BBQ in the Bridge and Texas in the Neck. Sound awsome. Right now I flpped between this one and my Blonde Daytona. But evertime I pull the 79Darkburst out of the case that guitar just has the Look!... But some guy in PA. has my Lightburst and evertime I get a guitar back from that guy I can't put it down...

[MN Hobbyist]

I can't see clearly enough on my iPhone, but if it's a 3 piece neck, it's been re-necked. Hamer used /of necks until mid 79. Rearamping the original serial is likely if it went to the factory. I can't tell, but if the tuners are smooth backed Grovers, they're correct for 77s too.

A lot of the early 1 pc necks twisted badly, so a warranty job would be likely Id guess.

Pardon my ignorance, but how do I tell if it's a 3-piece neck? By the way, here is another pic of the tuners so you can have a better look.

[BTMN]

That shot there shows the three piece neck and I lean towards those being original tuners withthe screw holes being from some replacements put on it by a previous owner. Those look '70s Grover to me from the shots.

[serial]

That shot there shows the three piece neck and I lean towards those being original tuners withthe screw holes being from some replacements put on it by a previous owner. Those look '70s Grover to me from the shots.

Agreed on both points (at least what I can see from my tiny phone monitor)!

[bubs_42]

Yep, the darker line in the center is the grain running in the oppisite direction. Doesn't make it any less cooler.

[Guest pirateflynn]

Serial, was there a greater occurance of warpage with crowned fingerboards? If so, why?

I've heard the fret-slot story but I have also heard that it was more prevalent with crowns. Don't know why.

[mirrorimij]

Could you show us a shot of the end grain on the headstock? The opposing grain of the individual pieces would be easier to see that way.

[MN Hobbyist]

Could you show us a shot of the end grain on the headstock? The opposing grain of the individual pieces would be easier to see that way.

Here's an end of headstock shot:

Any way of dating the neck?

[serial]

Serial, was there a greater occurance of warpage with crowned fingerboards? If so, why?

I've heard the fret-slot story but I have also heard that it was more prevalent with crowns. Don't know why.

Both Paul Hamer and Tom Holmes mentioned that to me- something to do with Holmes making his own jigs and Ma Pearl (sp?) doing the crown inlaid fingerboards offsite and there being a compatibility issue. I'd have to look through my interview materials for the whole story.