So, Does ONLY a Les Paul Sound Like a Les Paul?

[Halowords]

I know people often ask for, or talk about, a guitar that sounds like a Les Paul that ISN'T a Les Paul. This is a little different question. Kind of.

Does, or maybe a better question is WILL, Hamer make a custom guitar to the mass of a Les Paul?

I love my Hamer Studio, the my Les Paul (that I sold a while back) had that thicker, less trebly sound that I really like. It is not a huge gap, but it is a noticeable difference. Despite that, the Hamer Studio is a more fun guitar to play simply because the neck is nicer. The heel . . . Scratch that, LACK of a heel on the Studio, makes me more fluid playing up and down the neck of the guitar. So while I would like a thicker sounding guitar with an amazing low end crunch/growl/whatever, and Gibson gives me the mass I need for that, I do not think I can sacrifice the neck that I love so much on my Hamer.

So, my basic questions are:

1) Would Hamer custom make a guitar (preferably the Studio or Artist design, but I would could learn to deal with a single-cut again) with the thickness of a Les Paul (in body & sound) and the heel/neck of my Studio? I know it would be pricey, but that would be my dream guitar.

2) Does that guitar already exist? Somebody referred me to a Monaco Elite. However I thought they had a heel as well, and were not as thick as a Les Paul.

-Cheers

[RobB]

atquinn has a new, Floyd-ed Studio Custom that has a thicker-than-normal body, though I've no idea if it is similar to an LP's depth.

For a price, Hamer'll make you anything. Except, of course, a Les Paul.

[Guest pirateflynn]

I think the closest for what you're looking for is the Triple Threat. Here's a link, scroll down half way:

http://www.hamerguitars.com/?fa=customgallery#

[gwayne]

1) Would Hamer custom make a guitar (preferably the Studio or Artist design, but I would could learn to deal with a single-cut again) with the thickness of a Les Paul (in body & sound) and the heel/neck of my Studio? I know it would be pricey, but that would be my dream guitar.

The upcharge for a "Newport"-thick body on an Artist or Studio was $150 as of Jan. 2007. This is MSRP and the actual upcharge is probably less - check with a dealer for confirmation. The Newport is the same thickness as a Les Paul. IMO a Studio with this thickness may get you closer, but to get those great LP tones, you need TWO Tone controls and TWO Volume controls - and that's something Hamer won't do (or they wouldn't the last time I asked).

I had a Studio that sounded like a great Les Paul - until I got a Les Paul and I realized that while they are close, there's a lot of LP territory that a Studio just won't touch. Obviously YMMV.

I'm personally happier with my maple Newport than I was with either the Artist or Studio and it only has one volume, one tone - go figure .

[Matt Mattson]

One man's opinion: every Les Paul is different. Every guitar is different. Most electric guitars make no sound at all unless plugged into an amplifier. Every electric guitar plugged into an amplifier will sound different. Every amplifier is different. Every guitar with different pickups is different. Therefore, I have come to the conclusion, there is no Les Paul sound, unless Les Paul (still living) himself makes it.

Original music score by Rock Hard:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bMombOQhUNA

[atquinn]

As has been mentioned, my Floyd-ed Studio Custom has a 1/4" thicker than normal body. As soon as a heard this was an option, I ordered it because I figured the body mass added by the thicker body would compensate somewhat for the wood that was lost in the floyd routing and bellycut.

At any rate, I think I'm going to have to agree with Matt on this. There are so many models of Les Pauls with different construction types, I'm sure there's one out there that sounds just like your Studio . If your Studio is already pretty close, I would find out what pickups are in the Les Pauls you like, put those in the Studio, adjust your EQ to taste and call it a day.

-Austin

[JohnnyB]

Wouldn't a Monaco Elite be a better platform to start with before adding custom features?

[mirrorimij]

Hamer already built a Les Paul. I believe only one exists (besides the tooling prototypes that were never completed). IIRC, it belongs to someone at Kaman.

[El Kabong]

For a price, Hamer'll make you anything. Except, of course, a Les Paul.

...save for a short scale, single hum Chap, in black, with full boomers.

[Guest Meshuggah]

Hamer won't, but Washburn will.

[data187]

try a prs mccarty with a pickup swap.

i played a friends mccarty with burstbuckers in it and it sounded almost the same, if not better than a les paul classic that he owned.

[mirrorimij]

Hamer won't, but Washburn will.

Ummm, read my post above. They have already done it. Doesn't mean they will do it again but it's been done.

Bob P

[zorrow]

As mentioned, every guitar is different. However, I think you can get very close to the so-called "Les Paul sound " with any good guitar having a thick mahogany body, a set neck (mahogany too), the slight looseness of the 24.75" scale, a rosewood fretboard and a couple of good top-quality PAF (or even hotter) humbuckings. A maple top can also add some high end to the natural tone of the guitar -- which by the way, does exist.

So said, Hamer does build guitars with the specs above. Personally, I own two Vectors which would proudly stand on their own faced to any Les Paul -- Roli's 81 flamey and Peter's 84 blueburst. Monacos also sound really great -- I've played Nick's. And even if I've never played other top Hamers, I bet there are many more which would sound like a Les Paul, and even better!

By the way, in this thread I recently praised the tonal qualities of one of my guitars (a Hamer, yes), respect to a Les Paul: http://www.hamerfanclub.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=22114

[Wordupperman]

The two volume two tone set up isn't going to make a guitar sound like a LP, if you have the switch on one pickup, the load of the second vol and tone are out of the picture.

Wasn't the Triple Threat about as close to a LP as Hamer gets? One piece neck, thicker taper, 17 degree headstock, vintage tuneomatic, etc. Do those sound like a LP?

My understanding is that Hamer will do a lot of things, but not anything... even if you have the $$$$.

[Craig S]

I wonder if it has more to do with single cut vs. double cut coupled with mass. I have a FM, Standard, SG and a LP. The FM and Standard sound very close and somewhat similar to the Paul. The Paul still has something that is different that is hard to put my finger on, a "roundness" the others don't have. The SG has more bite that any of the others. I also have a LP Special singlecut(not with the P100s) that sounds different from any LP doublecuts or Hamer Specials I've played. Like the Standard it's subtle but different. All the 24.75 humbuckers guitars sound so close it's probably not worth the worry, but I still like my LPs

[Steve Haynie]

Wouldn't a Monaco Elite be a better platform to start with before adding custom features?

The Monaco Elite is smaller than the other Monaco models and comes closest to a Les Paul in size and design. The body thickness and single cutaway are part of what sets apart the Les Paul from other set-neck solid bodies.

As everyone else here has mentioned, the sound can vary. Atlanta Rhythm Section never got the same tone as Ace Frehley, but they all played Les Pauls. Les Paul himself sounds different from everyone else who plays his namesake guitar.

[mirrorimij]

Where is that smiley that is banging his head against a wall???????

[Boogie1]

It's all in the fingers.

My Les Paul can beat up your Les Paul.

[Wordupperman]

Where is that smiley that is banging his head against a wall???????

I think it's over at the LP forum...

"Q: Which Burstbucker will make me sound just like the solo on crossroads?

A: The Hausselhoff-Rio-Grande-Latte-extra-wind-no-whip-double-cream-add-shots, by WRXTone Labs, of course!... just tell 'em "BRC Ed" sent ya!

[Guest Meshuggah]

Hamer won't, but Washburn will.

Ummm, read my post above. They have already done it. Doesn't mean they will do it again but it's been done.

Bob P

My apologies. I mistook your request was for a superior LP clone.

[straightblues]

I have played guitar for 20 years. I have never owned a Les Paul until about 9 months ago. I always tried to avoid the overpriced Gibsons and sounding like everyone else. Well, my two Les Pauls, a Standard and a Historic R6 with P-90's get that Les Paul sound that we are all use to from the records. The sound isn't better or worst than other guitars, it has just become the standard of so many records. Suddenly with a Les Paul really nailing the tones on the records becomes much much easier. So I would say that if you really want that Les Paul sound get a Les Paul, nothing else will do it 100%. Many will get close, including several Hamers but none will get it 100%. I played about 125 Les Pauls in the process of buying my two guitars. They do vary in sound, wieght and tone. There are good ones, and flat out bad ones. I wouldn't buy one without trying it first. Each one has a slightly different voice.

The Les Pauls are not made as well as my Hamers (the fit and finish aren't even close).

[Halowords]

My apologies. I mistook your request was for a superior LP clone.

Close. It was for a superior LP TONE. Not familiar with Washburns overall. What model is that? Any thoughts on that guitar, why it is as good/better than a LP? Not necessarily looking for it to LOOK at all like a Les Paul, just want that thick tone. But I do appreciate the input.

I will probably end up with a Les Paul or similar build. Thinking about trying to build my own guitars as a hobby, and so I can putz around with the exact specs I want.

In the meantime, is there anything I can do with my Studio for a slightly thicker/fatter bottom end and smoothed-out highs? Will something like an Octave pedal or an EQ pedal be worth checking out? I would also be interested in trying some Seymour Duncan Seth Lover PAF-style pickups. They have always sounded pretty intriguing to me.

-Cheers

[atquinn]

My apologies. I mistook your request was for a superior LP clone.

Close. It was for a superior LP TONE. Not familiar with Washburns overall. What model is that? Any thoughts on that guitar, why it is as good/better than a LP? Not necessarily looking for it to LOOK at all like a Les Paul, just want that thick tone. But I do appreciate the input.

I will probably end up with a Les Paul or similar build. Thinking about trying to build my own guitars as a hobby, and so I can putz around with the exact specs I want.

In the meantime, is there anything I can do with my Studio for a slightly thicker/fatter bottom end and smoothed-out highs? Will something like an Octave pedal or an EQ pedal be worth checking out? I would also be interested in trying some Seymour Duncan Seth Lover PAF-style pickups. They have always sounded pretty intriguing to me.

-Cheers

If your Studio has Duncan 59's in it now, there are all sorts of pickups that should give you a thicker/fatter tone. The obvious suggestion would be trying something with Alnico II magnets (like Seth Lovers or Alnico II Pros, or a Custom Custom in the bridge if you want something hotter). They Seymour Duncan forum would be a great place to ask this question if you want to investigate swapping pickups. Before looking at spending money though, I'd try tweaking your EQ chain (on your guitar and amp), and messing around with the pickup height to see if those get you any closer to what you're looking for.

-

Austin

[Guest pirateflynn]

I am from the camp that it doesn't need to be a Les Paul to get a Les Paul type tone. We've been through this before but, which Les Paul tone ? ..... Betts, Gibbons, Frampton, Beck, Clapton, Page, Bloomfield or any of your other favorites. They all have different tone, executed on a tool. Hey, Jeff Beck would sound like himself playing a Daisy Rock! (nothin' wrong with Daisy Rock)

Some variations suit different players while they bother others. A thinner mahogany body with a thick maple top might be a little too bright and immediate for the classic rock thing but would work well for higher gain applications, etc.

If the basic elements are there, you'll be in the ballpark and then the rest is up to you.

[Halowords]

We've been through this before but, which Les Paul tone ? ..... Betts, Gibbons, Frampton, Beck, Clapton, Page, Bloomfield or any of your other favorites.

Not necessarily any of them. I guess I would like to get somewhere in the ballpark of Clapton on "While My Guitar Gently Weeps," or Blake Schwarzenbach from Jawbreaker. But honestly, I am thinking the general tone of my guitar, which sounds great strummed unplugged, only a bit thicker/growlier/warmer. Not light years away from where it is now. I only compare it to a Les Paul because the one that I had was able to have a nice, thicker sound that I have now.

But I am NOT trying to replicate or clone the sound from any artist. Just trying to get the tone I associate with Les Pauls I have heard and that I associate (for right or wrong) with the slightly thicker body, perhaps the covered pickups, and maybe the single-cut design. That being said, I think a Hamer Studio or PRS will get pretty close. If it is not EXACTLY like a LP, that is fine. But I want to make it sound like what I want it to, not trying to clone/replicate anything. I want to sound like myself, only moderately fuller/thicker than I do now, preferably taking the guitar I have now or eventually getting something that will get that sound.

-Cheers