Heavy guage strings?

[morningstar]

I have been a 10 - 46 guy forever. My MIK Daytona feels too loose. I like some fight back from a guitar (I have no finesse/I am a masher). The tremolo is blocked. The most I ever tune down is one half step.

Am I going to create issues by using a heavier string?

I see 11-49, 11-50, 11-52 and 11-54 available. How much is too much?

Thanks

morningstar

[mjtripper]

On a well built guitar like a hamer you should have no problem with 11s or even 12s. You might have to make a truss rod adjustment though. I even use 12s on some of my guitars and have never had a problem. Think of it this way - most light acoustic guitar strings START at 12 and go heavier.

[gtone]

Watch for binding at the nut with heavier guage strings. Might need a little filing/dressing as the nut's designed for 10's, IIRC. If you don't know what you're doing, don't modify the nut at all as you can f*** it up easily. And yeah - Chapstick, Nut Sauce or graphite from a pencil lead are your friends also.

[morningstar]

Thanks guys. I slop Nut Sauce on all my guitars. That ought to work well enough to figure out if heavy strings are what I needed.

morningstar

[JohnnyB]

Gauge isn't the only factor in tension. Different string designs have different tension at the same gauge. Hexagonal core has a higher tension than round core. Stainless wrap has a higher tension than nickel, with NPS (nickel-plated steel) and alloy 52 (iron/nickel) in between.

I have a Newport and liked a variety of strings on it, but when I put Elixir 11-49s on, it really came alive.

I think you'd be happy with 11-49, perhaps with NPS-wrapped hex core. That should give you plenty of snap-back.

[GusS]

Thanks guys. I slop Nut Sauce on all.

morningstar

[Hamer Time]

I use D'Addario light jazz 12-52 on my '94 Daytona with no problems. I did have it set up, and plek'd, professionally when I first bought it though. My trem is blocked also.

[morningstar]

Thanks Johnny... you really do reduce everything to a science.

11-49 NPS hex cores... I will try em.

morningstar

[zorrow]

I use quite heavy strings: 11-15-20-36-46-58 for D tuning, and 10-13-17-32-42-54 for standard tuning.

It's hard to say what's "too much", as it depends on the player, of course.

In my own case, I settled to heavy gauge strings because I like the lower register to sound tight, and more tension allows me to tremolo-pick with more articulation -hate flabby lows.

I also tend to press on the frets too much, as if I was struggling with the neck. Heavy gauges thus compensate for my lack of technique, by creating the resistance I need to counter-balance the exaggerated strength I put into it.

The problems I've found: one, it's harder to have a "light touch"; two, your truss-rod needs to be re-adjusted, as you add a lot of extra tension; three, your fellow guitar players will hate to play your guitar, as they wouldn't be able to play it properly; four, some chords become very hard to play; five, it might cause some extra buzzing, which you'll have to fix; six, you'll need to get used to it, as the strings do feel "thicker"; seven, your tone will change, but it's a myth it will "improve" -that depends on your tastes, your fingers... and on your beliefs; eight, you'll have to file wider slots in your nut, which will spoil an easy rollback, if you ever don't like it; nine, more tension means your tuners should be able to handle it, so you better get some locking tuners -besides using nut sauce; ten, your fingers and wrist will suffer more -you'll need to warm up properly and keep an eye on signals of muscular/tendon strain... and so on.

Hope this helped!

[jwhitcomb3]

Sometimes just a little more metal is all you need. I like the D'Addario "plus" strings:

Plus

I like these on Fender scale guitars for a little more snap.

[zorrow]

Sometimes just a little more metal is all you need. I like the D'Addario "plus" strings:

Plus

I like these on Fender scale guitars for a little more snap.

Thanks a lot for that link! Not for me, but some fellow players sometimes ask me what I would recommend that wouldn't be "too much" -as if I knew! I guess suggesting them to try those you just mentioned would be a safe answer.

[LostArt]

i had 9's on my junior then 10's and now I use 11-54

each guitar has a different feel.

I choose the strings according to the guitar.

every time I played the junior I felt that I was just not getting the sound I wanted with the strings being way too slinky so off I went to experiment with ernie ball beefy slinky and the d addario jazz set with an unwound g

the 11's are now where I need to be with that guitar. great tone and they still bend as easily as the lighter ones. IMHO or I guess I should say if I can't bend a set of 11's I have no business playing guitar anymore

[zenmindbeginner]

Heavier gauge strings focus more of the tone on the fundamental. Light gauge strings emphasize the harmonics.

How hard you pick also has an effect on the fundamental vs. the harmonic content.

Then there is the issue of what kind of harmonics are being represented by your axe, rig and playing style...

is there a predominance of even or odd order harmonics?

String tension and scale length is another factor too.

A switch to heavier gauge strings will lose a little pizzaz and unicorn dust in favor for more directed and tighter bass... it's generally a heavier sound. Single notes will have more weight to them and complex chords featuring extended harmony will ring a bit more "true". Dissonance will sound a bit less harsh.

I find that heavier gauge strings sort of filter out the odd order harmonics a bit, leaving the even order harmonics left mostly untouched. The increased fundamental along with less odd order harmonics will 9 times out of 10 improve one's tone.

The downside is that legato playing is made much more difficult with heavier strings and you may need to up your pick's gauge too. Nut slots can also bind leading to tuning issues (this was already mentioned).

I play a 12 gauge set on my dropped B tuned Scarab (with a 13 gauge low E and A) ... all of my other guitars have 10 gauge strings, So I do go back and forth between heavy and light quite often.

[zorrow]

I find that heavier gauge strings sort of filter out the odd order harmonics a bit, leaving the even order harmonics left mostly untouched. The increased fundamental along with less odd order harmonics will 9 times out of 10 improve one's tone.

That's very interesting and seems very well-founded.

However, Brian May uses very light gauge for a 24" scale (.009 .011 .016 .024 .032 .042); Yngwie uses 0.08, 0.11, 0.14, 0.22, 0.34, 0.46 (very light for me, and in addition he tunes to E-flat); George Lynch uses standard 0.09's, as well as Michael Schenker; Billy Gibbons uses 0.08 and I've even heard that he has used 0.07...

And it's funny all those guys I just mentioned above are for me THE references when I talk about tone.

Hypothesis: Maybe odd order harmonics can color your tone in a way that it can also improve?

[zenmindbeginner]

I find that heavier gauge strings sort of filter out the odd order harmonics a bit, leaving the even order harmonics left mostly untouched. The increased fundamental along with less odd order harmonics will 9 times out of 10 improve one's tone.

That's very interesting and seems very well-founded.

However, Brian May uses very light gauge for a 24" scale (.009 .011 .016 .024 .032 .042); Yngwie uses 0.08, 0.11, 0.14, 0.22, 0.34, 0.46 (very light for me, and in addition he tunes to E-flat); George Lynch uses standard 0.09's, as well as Michael Schenker; Billy Gibbons uses 0.08 and I've even heard that he has used 0.07...

And it's funny all those guys I just mentioned above are for me THE references when I talk about tone.

Hypothesis: Maybe odd order harmonics can color your tone in a way that it can also improve?

Excellent observation on the predominance of light gauge strings being used by most of the 70's and 80's guitar gods. Eddie used .009s... it's basically SRV who used the heavier strings.

Well, what these light string players all have in common is a rig that is rich in even order harmonics. I must profess that I know absolutely nothing about Michael Shenker's tone but Yngwie, Lynch, May, Page and EVH all used non master volume amps... I'm not sure about Gibbons though, he is very obfuscatory when talking about his tone. Pick attack has a lot to do with tone and all of these guys are MASTERS of pick attack.

It's a subtle thing about the change in harmonics when moving to heavier strings... what do you personally experience in harmonic terms when you go from your detuned to standard guitars?

[zorrow]

It's a subtle thing about the change in harmonics when moving to heavier strings... what do you personally experience in harmonic terms when you go from your detuned to standard guitars?

My perception is that higher tension implies a more "focused" tone; while lower tension implies a more "open" tone.

That's why I try to use the lightest gauge I can tolerate for the three higher strings, in order to keep a certain "vocal quality" in my lead tone; while for the three lower strings I favor "tightness" and focus, so a heavier gauge does the trick.

I guess then that "openness" I perceive (meaning nasal and/or vocal overtones) is the effect of odd harmonics, right?

BTW, I use metal and glass picks, by Dugain, as well as 3 mm Big Stubby picks. That's absolutely a factor to get a very sharp attack, which is a key ingredient of my tone.

[morningstar]

I just wanted the action to have more fight in it.

I ordered up a set of 11-49's.

report to follow.

morningstar

[jwhitcomb3]

I just wanted the action to have more fight in it.

I ordered up a set of 11-49's.

report to follow.

morningstar

Agreed. I started looking into heavier strings when going from Fender scale to Hamers, and missing the snap in the strings. I drive the pick hard, and don't like a sloppy response. I particularly like the Thomistik-Infeld Power-Brights .011 .015 .019 .032 .045 .053 (Heavy Bottom) on my Eclipses.

Regarding the discussion of even/odd harmonics, I like to drive the string with a strong fundamental, and let the my amp provide the harmonic distortion. Different amps or amp models will let you choose the harmonics you want to bring out. If excess harmonics are there at the input, the output ends up sounding like mush.

[Caddie]

on the other side of the spectrum, Billy Gibbons uses 7s !

[velorush]

I just wanted the action to have more fight in it.

I ordered up a set of 11-49's.

report to follow.

morningstar

Agreed. I started looking into heavier strings when going from Fender scale to Hamers, and missing the snap in the strings. I drive the pick hard, and don't like a sloppy response. I particularly like the Thomistik-Infeld Power-Brights .011 .015 .019 .032 .045 .053 (Heavy Bottom) on my Eclipses.

Regarding the discussion of even/odd harmonics, I like to drive the string with a strong fundamental, and let the my amp provide the harmonic distortion. Different amps or amp models will let you choose the harmonics you want to bring out. If excess harmonics are there at the input, the output ends up sounding like mush.

Same boat here. I just put GHS Boomers Mediums (.11 - .50) on my Gibson. I've been playing Strats so much that the Gibson felt mushy. The Mediums are much better and seem to have close to the same string tension, maybe a bit more. I may end up trying out one of those 0.105 sets to tweak it a bit more. The Gibson has a trapeze, so while the scale length is shorter, the string length isn't that much shorter.

One odd thing about the GHS Mediums, they go .11 .15 .18 .26 .36 .50. The Boomers Lights I was using were .10 .13 .17 .26 .36 .46 - so the A and D strings are the same gauge as I was playing. They feel a little weird in this group of heavier strings.