Finish of a Hamer sunburst from 1992

[hamer_sunburst]

Hi guys,

I was wondering what kind of finishes does Hamer use? Nitro or Poly? I have a beautiful Hamer which is nearly 20 years old now and the finish really doesn't look like nitro, as it doesn't crack or shrink. It doesn't look like poly either...

Thanks

[Stike]

There's a lot of different "poly"s out there. Around 91/92 they transitioned from lacquer to a CAB urethane from the now out of business Lawrence McFadden company. Seagraves Coatings bought the LMF formulas and are manufacturing them so maybe they are still using it? Jol would refer to it as Urelac and the tech sheets from LMF called it "Urethane Guitar Lacquer".

[hamer_sunburst]

There's a lot of different "poly"s out there. Around 91/92 they transitioned from lacquer to a CAB urethane from the now out of business Lawrence McFadden company. Seagraves Coatings bought the LMF formulas and are manufacturing them so maybe they are still using it? Jol would refer to it as Urelac and the tech sheets from LMF called it "Urethane Guitar Lacquer".

How about the new Hamers, starting from about 2004? Poly as well? I had a Monaco Elite a while back, from 2004, it was a great guitar as well.

Why does Jol go for Poly finishes? I don't get it. His instruments (at least the Monaco and Studio) are supposed to have that vintage vibe, and he's using poly finishes, I don't get it...

[Stike]

It's technically not "poly" even though it is a catalyzed finish. At the last HFC open house (what year was that again?) they were still using the McFaddens (now Seagrave) CAB so I'm just guessing they are still using it?

Not sure what Jol is using on the Dantzig's. I remember one of his blog posts talking about trying some new waterbased clear.

[velorush]

Why does Jol go for Poly finishes? I don't get it. His instruments (at least the Monaco and Studio) are supposed to have that vintage vibe, and he's using poly finishes, I don't get it...

...it doesn't crack or shrink.

Order of messages changed to provide clarity.

I'll add: it doesn't get sticky when the humidity gets up, is harder, looks nicer longer, takes way less time to cure (and move to the next step in assembly), etc. I think catalyzed finishes got a bad wrap from the way they were/are used by Fender, especially in the 70's. There are actually quite a few manufacturers using much thinner catalyzed finishes (including Hamer, Surh, Taylor, Melancon) to great effect. Even now, Fender's "nitro" isn't the same as "nitro" lacquer from back in the day (and, <looks both ways> they put a catalyzed base coat on before the "nitro" - shhhhh).

I've got a "nitro"-finished Fender coming in tomorrow that had a neck replaced under warranty. The original (twisted) neck had finally gotten cured out where it wasn't sticky. I'm glad to be getting a replacement neck, but not looking forward to the neck being sticky. Is the tone better for the "nitro"? Well, it is an incredibly resonant Strat, but I think it has way more to do with the baseball bat-sized neck, lightweight body and really tight neck/body joint than the finish. YMMV

[atquinn]

There's a lot of different "poly"s out there. Around 91/92 they transitioned from lacquer to a CAB urethane from the now out of business Lawrence McFadden company. Seagraves Coatings bought the LMF formulas and are manufacturing them so maybe they are still using it? Jol would refer to it as Urelac and the tech sheets from LMF called it "Urethane Guitar Lacquer".

How about the new Hamers, starting from about 2004? Poly as well? I had a Monaco Elite a while back, from 2004, it was a great guitar as well.

Why does Jol go for Poly finishes? I don't get it. His instruments (at least the Monaco and Studio) are supposed to have that vintage vibe, and he's using poly finishes, I don't get it...

I don't know why Jol decided on it, but I'm thrilled Hamer doesn't use nitro. I dislike it on every level.

-Austin

[Armitage]

Terry Mcinturf claims it's not so much the finish, it's the thickness of the finish. Most polys are very thick while nitro drys very thin...

[atquinn]

I like Terry's guitar, but I can't stand the Nitro finish on those either! All the upper-echelon builders use thin finishes regardless of the type. There are plenty of thick nitro finishes out there as well. It basically comes down to personal preference.

-

Austin

[zenmindbeginner]

Catalyzed lacquer finishes have a mil thickness limit and are generally applied very thin.

Catalyzed lacquers, CAB and nitrocellulose lacquers are all cellulosics and are chemically more similar than they are different.

Poly derives resins from petroleum.

Nitrocellulose resins come from cellulose broken down by nitric and sulfuric acids.

Shellac resins come from beetle shit.

A resin is a resin.

F**k, I thought I had a point somewhere... my bad. lolz

[Steve Haynie]

The finish on a Hamer is supposed to be approximately .012" which is about the thickness, or thinness, of a B string.

[tbonesullivan]

wait... they still made sunbursts in 1992? I thought they had morphed into the studio by that point?

[Steve Haynie]

wait... they still made sunbursts in 1992? I thought they had morphed into the studio by that point?

The Sunburst label was still on the guitars up through 1992.

[crunchee]

wait... they still made sunbursts in 1992? I thought they had morphed into the studio by that point?

The Sunburst label was still on the guitars up through 1992.

No real 'morphing' occured from what I can tell at that time. Just lotsa confusing name changes, and it didn't stop there. The only real change that I can tell at the time on these guitars, were that the necks had a fairly thin profile until '93, then went to a medium thickness. For some reason, the tops and colors used on the old Sunbursts in the early '90's were probably the best ever, FANTASTIC flame and colors, done just right IMHO. Now if they only had a thicker neck...

P.S. Don't look at the import lines or versions for any type of name logic in comparison to the USA made line, it just makes things worse.

But back to the original topic, it seems like there was a early '90's Sunburst on eBay a couple of months ago or so, I don't think it was here in the US, though (Australia, I think)...anyway, it DID have weather checking, but not in a small way, but in a big, ugly way. Not lots of checks, but they were pretty obvious and long, across the face of the guitar. It looked like it didn't behave like a nitro finish, but more like the finish had fractured rather than checked, like a stress fracture in a glass auto windshield. I'm thinking that you would've had to put that guitar through a hellaciously severe temperature change for that to have happen. I haven't seen one occur like that before or since.

[hamer_sunburst]

wait... they still made sunbursts in 1992? I thought they had morphed into the studio by that point?

This is a 1992 Sunburst which is an absolutle KILLER guitar, which I got for a killer price as well. It is almost as new, although 20 years old. Only "problem" is... you guessed it: hameritis.

The finish is still solid as a rock, no aging, no nothing. Well, not quite true, the binding has gotten yellowish, but that's the binding, not the finish.

wait... they still made sunbursts in 1992? I thought they had morphed into the studio by that point?

The Sunburst label was still on the guitars up through 1992.

No real 'morphing' occured from what I can tell at that time. Just lotsa confusing name changes, and it didn't stop there. The only real change that I can tell at the time on these guitars, were that the necks had a fairly thin profile until '93, then went to a medium thickness. For some reason, the tops and colors used on the old Sunbursts in the early '90's were probably the best ever, FANTASTIC flame and colors, done just right IMHO. Now if they only had a thicker neck...

P.S. Don't look at the import lines or versions for any type of name logic in comparison to the USA made line, it just makes things worse.

But back to the original topic, it seems like there was a early '90's Sunburst on eBay a couple of months ago or so, I don't think it was here in the US, though (Australia, I think)...anyway, it DID have weather checking, but not in a small way, but in a big, ugly way. Not lots of checks, but they were pretty obvious and long, across the face of the guitar. It looked like it didn't behave like a nitro finish, but more like the finish had fractured rather than checked, like a stress fracture in a glass auto windshield. I'm thinking that you would've had to put that guitar through a hellaciously severe temperature change for that to have happen. I haven't seen one occur like that before or since.

Mine has hameritis which is a finish issue I guess. It doesn't really bother me, but do you know it can be "cured" by any chance??

Neck: The neck is really quite skinny. I thought I wouldn't like it, but maaan, this neck really rocks. I guess it has to do with the neck profile as well. It's got quite a flat profile on top, which helps for bendings and nice vibrato, the frets are like on an original 1958 LP, rather slim. Man, it really is a wicked guitar. And BTW, it's got a long neck tenon as well.

I think the guitar compares quite well to a PRS Santana model.

[burningyen]

I remember reading that people have cured Hameritis by injecting something into the bubble.

[hamer_sunburst]

I remember reading that people have cured Hameritis by injecting something into the bubble.

Only a luthier can do that I suppose... will think about it, but I'm not in a hurry for this.