Shipping overseas and CITES - anyone have horror stories?

[ChugD]

I managed to get a mahogany guitar with an ebony board shipped recently from Japan to the US with no issues.   It spent all of 2 minutes in customs.  On some other forums, I read about people having issues, even with old guitars pre-restriction.  I guess the main target is Brazilian rosewood, but I don't have enough expertise to tell what species some of these boards are.  I also do I trust a officer of things that are wood stuck in a dark room in a shipping depot.  Anyone have any extensive experience or know the letter of the law?

[Dave Scepter]

I've purchased a few guitars from Japan and normally they arrive within 2 to 3 days to Arizona "not sure how they do it but quite impressive"... however, my Momose Korina Mex took about 1 1/2 months to arrive after Fedex custom inquiries, numerous back and forth emails/phone calls 🤬

Note photo from Reverb cuz I'm too lazy to actually snap a pic 😴 

Edited November 30, 2023 by Dave Scepter

[ChugD]

1 hour ago, Dave Scepter said:

numerous back and forth emails/phone calls

So their concern was the fingerboard wood?

[Dave Scepter]

21 minutes ago, ChugD said:

So their concern was the fingerboard wood?

Yes sir, tried telling them it's Madagascar Rosewood not Brazilian... which is weird because the other guitars cleared no problem... 

Edited November 30, 2023 by Dave Scepter

[Disturber]

13 hours ago, Dave Scepter said:

I've purchased a few guitars from Japan and normally they arrive within 2 to 3 days to Arizona "not sure how they do it but quite impressive"... however, my Momose Korina Mex took about 1 1/2 months to arrive after Fedex custom inquiries, numerous back and forth emails/phone calls 🤬

Note photo from Reverb cuz I'm too lazy to actually snap a pic 😴 

 

They most probably thought that Momose was an exotic fruit, hidden somewhere in the case.

[ARM OF HAMER]

                                    Glad that I'm out of the business of buying or selling a guitar/s to an over sea buyer. Given the right situation a MIGHT do it but I would have to think long and hard about it. One of the last guitars [ A Yamaha SA-1200S ]  I shipped overseas went to a great buyer from Germany and it went through w/o out a hitch. I believe it cost me $130.00 all in to ship it USPS EXPRESS MAIL with full insurance for the value of the guitar, these days I can't imagine what it would be now. I have bought quite a few guitars from a seller in Japan back when he was in business and he sent everything EMS and they all got here just as sent from Japan in 2-3 days! Now with shipping anything you always have to wonder If it will get there or if and when I [Or who] will get it.

Edited December 1, 2023 by ARM OF HAMER

[ChugD]

1 hour ago, ARM OF HAMER said:

Given the right situation a MIGHT do it but I would have to think long and hard about it.

There is where I am at.  The good deals seem rare, especially on well known brands.  I went in on my one Japan purchase with the mindset that I could totally lose out and the guitar would disappear in an Indiana Jones Holy Grail type warehouse.  Luckily it worked out that time.  I also thought I read that guitars made before a certain year (whenever CITES was instituted) were exempt, but other articles say that is not the case.

[currypowder]

I have imported countless guitars from Japan and can count on one hand the times there was even an inquiry from the shipper. I find DHL to be the most inquisitive, then FedEx. I have never had an inquiry when using EMS/USPS. I try to avoid DHL at all costs, they are just a PITA IMO.

Even when there was an inquiry, I was always able to clear the issue with a quick phone call or by filling out a simple form. @Dave Scepter 's experience was, IMO, a fairly rare occurrence. Although I'm sure it didn't feel rare to him. I'm just glad it eventually cleared.

The value of the guitar has an effect. In my experience with FedEx, if the value is $800 or below, it tends to fly right through with no duties charges. Between $800 and $2,500, there my be a quick inquiry and duties will be charged. Over $2,500, expect an inquiry and duties will be charged. This is only for FedEx, who is the shipper I've used the most. For EMS/USPS, they tend to clear customs with no duties charged regardless of value.

I won't have a guitar shipped via FedEx on Friday or Saturday as those tend to travel through Anchorage Alaska. For whatever reason, the customs folks there take a hard look at almost everything. 

As far as CITES goes as it relates to guitars, Brazilian rosewood is the only wood that should cause any problems. And generally only if it is declared as such. I am unaware of any situation where a guitar has been permanently held up at customs and/or sent back to the shipper due to an agent making an independent determination that Brazilian RW was present. There was a brief time where ALL rosewood was restricted, but an exception was made for musical instruments for non-Brazilian RW.

[ChugD]

Awesome explanation!   I feel a bit better about trying it again.  TYVM!

[Winter]

I’m expecting a Rahbek Standard to be shipped to me from TX sometime in the next couple of weeks. I’ve specifically requested USPS / Canada Post as the shipper to avoid the brokerage fee hassles and customs delays UPS are so fond of inflicting. It’s got a Brazilian fretboard so here’s hoping all will be well. 

[donner]

14 hours ago, Winter said:

I’m expecting a Rahbek Standard to be shipped to me from TX sometime in the next couple of weeks. I’ve specifically requested USPS / Canada Post as the shipper to avoid the brokerage fee hassles and customs delays UPS are so fond of inflicting. It’s got a Brazilian fretboard so here’s hoping all will be well. 

How'd you come across that one? Rahbek is a Danish luthierwith very small numbers of outcome.

They look a lot like current Xotic-stuff.

Simon Gotthelf plays one in some of his Komet-Demos, that made me aware of the brand.

 

[Winter]

1 hour ago, donner said:

How'd you come across that one? Rahbek is a Danish luthierwith very small numbers of outcome.

They look a lot like current Xotic-stuff.

Simon Gotthelf plays one in some of his Komet-Demos, that made me aware of the brand.

 

I found out about this one through Heritage Auctions. It was formerly owned by Rick Derringer. I didn’t buy it because of its history, rather, it ticks off all the boxes that I consider when thinking about what my ideal guitar might be.

Heritage have had some very interesting guitar auctions over the last few months and on occasion, a few nice Hamer’s have popped up as well.

You can set up an online profile/account and select any auctions that strike your interest. Just be sure to factor in the 25% buyers premium and shipping/taxes when making any bids. 

I also snagged this one… an 80’s ESP 400 Series Strat with a lovely set of Bill Lawrence pickups and a ‘63 Strat case.

 

Edited December 17, 2023 by Winter

[crunchee]

On 12/1/2023 at 2:18 AM, Disturber said:

They most probably thought that Momose was an exotic fruit, hidden somewhere in the case.

Or sparkling wine/Champagne and orange juice.  

[Disturber]

10 minutes ago, crunchee said:

Or sparkling wine/Champagne and orange juice.  

It seems to be one hell of a drinking thing, this Momose https://www.momosejulia.com/kitchen-counter-cocktails

[murkat]

few years ago i imported a specific japan made guitar. having gone thru the process before without problems and easy transaction of i thought i was good to go. nope.

i went thru the whole gambit on this guitar, all paperwork, certifications, etc. with no help from the seller/ dealer. i eventually received the instrument. i will not be doing it again.

[LucSulla]

On 12/1/2023 at 8:55 AM, currypowder said:

I have imported countless guitars from Japan and can count on one hand the times there was even an inquiry from the shipper. I find DHL to be the most inquisitive, then FedEx. I have never had an inquiry when using EMS/USPS. I try to avoid DHL at all costs, they are just a PITA IMO.

Even when there was an inquiry, I was always able to clear the issue with a quick phone call or by filling out a simple form. @Dave Scepter 's experience was, IMO, a fairly rare occurrence. Although I'm sure it didn't feel rare to him. I'm just glad it eventually cleared.

The value of the guitar has an effect. In my experience with FedEx, if the value is $800 or below, it tends to fly right through with no duties charges. Between $800 and $2,500, there my be a quick inquiry and duties will be charged. Over $2,500, expect an inquiry and duties will be charged. This is only for FedEx, who is the shipper I've used the most. For EMS/USPS, they tend to clear customs with no duties charged regardless of value.

I won't have a guitar shipped via FedEx on Friday or Saturday as those tend to travel through Anchorage Alaska. For whatever reason, the customs folks there take a hard look at almost everything. 

As far as CITES goes as it relates to guitars, Brazilian rosewood is the only wood that should cause any problems. And generally only if it is declared as such. I am unaware of any situation where a guitar has been permanently held up at customs and/or sent back to the shipper due to an agent making an independent determination that Brazilian RW was present. There was a brief time where ALL rosewood was restricted, but an exception was made for musical instruments for non-Brazilian RW.

If I'm not mistaken, that could be because below $800, there are no duties to charge.

https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/national-media-release/de-minimis-value-increases-800