Stainless Steel Frets

[Dutchman]

I just finished my first stainless steel fret job. I have them on several guitars and love them. This was my first time installing them. I gotta say you need to figure more time with them than standard frets. They're a higher lever of difficulty to install. So for those considering installing SS frets add about 20% more time. That's close to what I figured it took. 

The joy is the smile on the customers face when the do their first string bend with them. Worth every bit of the extra it takes

[kizanski]

I had stainless frets on a McNaught. First time I ever payed on them and I couldn't believe how different they felt.

There's a guitar repair guy near me who will do stainless frets for you if you want, but he's going to charge you 50% more because (he says) he needs to replace his fret files after ever stainless fret job.
Don't know how accurate that is, but it sounded reasonable at the time.

[Dutchman]

15 minutes ago, kizanski said:

 but he's going to charge you 50% more because (he says) he needs to replace his fret files after ever stainless fret job.
 

That sounds reasonable. Labor is more intense for sure.  I have some great files and it definatly made them work harder, but I don't think it damaged them. I guess I'll find out next fret job!! 

 

[Steve Haynie]

Do you overbend the stainless steel frets before installing them, or do you bend them to the fretboard radius and stop there? 

[Dutchman]

1 hour ago, Steve Haynie said:

Do you overbend the stainless steel frets before installing them, or do you bend them to the fretboard radius and stop there? 

It was my first time w the SS. I used a slight bend, hammered and then pressed. Looked for rockers and tapped them in. That part wasn't so bad. The leveling, crowning and fret ends took more work than usual. Or I should say slower than usual. 

I'm hoping the fret guys might chime in with some tips. I'm just a rookie.

[Jeff R]

I don't overbend and try to match radius with SS, even when I glue in frets.  On that note, I always glue in frets now whether NS or SS, and that's after experimenting over time with multiple reps of both glue and non-glue approaches on various fingerboards.

If you want DIY tips, you gotta be more specific. There are literally dozens of tasks, techniques and tool choices associated with fretwork.

The most fundamental tips I'd offer would be to tool up properly and put in dozens of reps on guitars that don't matter before you take on guitars that do matter. You learn or apply something new EVERY refret job. At least I do.

And watch every pro video you can put your eyes on and look for the common denominators among the pros, whether it's tool selection, fret selection, removing frets, FB and slot prep, fretwire prep, installation techniques, bevel and end dress, LCP, etc.  I'd start with the DIY fretwork playlist on StewMac's YouTube channel.

Since we like eye candy, here's my most recent refret. A slot head steel string Tak owned by an 85-year old gentleman in NC. He is losing hand strength due to age and asked for a refret with NS 57110s (second-largest common jumbo), conversion to nylons and super low action.

[Victor (Fret Friend)]

Same as Jeff: I always try and match the radius or if I do overbend, it's by a hair only! I also always glue frets in now. You must use the very best tools regardless of price. I only use the best tools for everything nowadays: I have learnt that if you buy cheap (tools) you buy many times. I am fortunate that there are some fabulous small-time tool makers in England. Chris Allsop makes amazing tools for stupidly inexpensive prices. I also had a guy (named Haris) in Greece make me stupid-accurate precision tools (he no longer makes them as he runs Halon Guitar Parts). Most of my files are Stewmac diamond files. I have some great Swiss-made smooth files (precision flat and sharp) by Vallorbe (number 4 cut: very smooth). My fret nib cutters are Stewmac and are built to cut stainless. I add 33% more cost on an SS refret but it is worth the extra effort. My tools handle stainless well. In fact, I have had my Stewmac Z-File a couple of years and it's still going strong. They will replace it for free when I need a new one: take advantage of Stewmac's Lifetime Warranty!!!

The Super Glue Gel I use is this by Loctite (super good):

 

[DaveH]

@Jeff R @Victor (Fret Friend) Dan Erlewine was super gluing frets back in the 90's. I remember thinking it would be hell on the next go around... Any experience with that yet, and how does it impact your approach? Just curious.

[Steve Haynie]

At the Ovation factory repair shop they used a wood glue for fret work that could be released with heat. 

[Jeff R]

CA glue is released very easily with heat, zero issues.

I usually install via arbor press.  Three small dots of 30 weight gel CA on the tang and then I wick the installed fret with 10 weight water-thin CA.

If I'm installing frets with a brass head hammer (F15 and up on a traditional acoustic for example), I only wick in the 10 weight CA. Even 30 weight gel can and will splatter from a hammer hit.

On that note, to protect the FB from glue where it doesn't belong, you put a layer of paste wax on the surface prior to fret installation. After installation, I remove any glue seep or squeeze-out and the wax with acetone on a cloth. DO NOT get ANY acetone on modern plastic inlays or dots! Be sure to re-oil after acetone treatment in the case of FB woods other than maple.

Here's the above guitar during the refret. I had finished pressing the trunk register and had moved to hammering in the body register. You can see the sheen of the paste wax on the fingerboard and the water-thin CA, it's the bottle with the whip tip applicator.

 

[Victor (Fret Friend)]

I've never had a problem removing glued in frets with heat (and a fret chip stopper)...

[Dutchman]

I think I'm headed in the right direction, dozen plus regular fret jobs, my 1st stainless. I have some great files from Germany, Swiss Files, and my angle block and flat file magnetic holder came from a Shop in Greece. I'd like a Z file. All my other files are top flight Stewy Mac stuff including my nut files. I'm going to start gluing with CA glue. Good advise from all. Now I need another test subject!!

Thank you to @Jeff R and @Victor (Fret Friend) for the great advise. 

[burningyen]

I use SS on guitars I sell, but honestly I've never had an issue with fret wear on NS and can get equally smooth feel on NS. This was on my daughter's old Squier, out of the box:

After a good polish:

[tbonesullivan]

IMHO, the feel of freshly crowned / polished NS frets is ALMOST the same as Stainless steel. The main thing is that the SS frets stay that way, almost indefinitely, while the NS frets will oxidize and wear a bit, which means you loose that slippery feeling. If you polish the NS frets it comes back for a bit, but will eventually be gone again.

Also, the bottoms of the strings wear / crush a bit too when being played. I'm always on the fence about whether I love or hate the way strings feel when I first put them on. They just seem super buzzy / live until the bottoms of the would strings get a bit crushed / worn.

Anyway, I have had SS fretted guitars, and currently have two EBMM guitars with Stainless frets. I also have a PRS CE 24, and they supposedly use harder fret material, or maybe just work harden them more. You get used to it.

As to whether they wear on tools more? Absolutely, as the material is harder than Nickel Silver. They could probably come up with a Stainless Steel alloy that was the same hardness as Nickel Silver, but then it would wear just as quickly.

[scottcald]

On 10/21/2023 at 2:09 AM, Victor (Fret Friend) said:

Same as Jeff: I always try and match the radius or if I do overbend, it's by a hair only! I also always glue frets in now. You must use the very best tools regardless of price. I only use the best tools for everything nowadays: I have learnt that if you buy cheap (tools) you buy many times. I am fortunate that there are some fabulous small-time tool makers in England. Chris Allsop makes amazing tools for stupidly inexpensive prices. I also had a guy (named Haris) in Greece make me stupid-accurate precision tools (he no longer makes them as he runs Halon Guitar Parts). Most of my files are Stewmac diamond files. I have some great Swiss-made smooth files (precision flat and sharp) by Vallorbe (number 4 cut: very smooth). My fret nib cutters are Stewmac and are built to cut stainless. I add 33% more cost on an SS refret but it is worth the extra effort. My tools handle stainless well. In fact, I have had my Stewmac Z-File a couple of years and it's still going strong. They will replace it for free when I need a new one: take advantage of Stewmac's Lifetime Warranty!!!

The Super Glue Gel I use is this by Loctite (super good):

 

I bought a couple of things from Chris Alsop and also thought they were reasonably priced (and shipping to the states wasn't bad either a few years back).