What is a tweed?

[Saul Goodman]

California Tweed looked interesting but I'm confused on what a Tweed sound is other than clean. 

[DaveH]

A Tweed, in my opinion, is not what you could call clean (except at lower volumes.) They tend to overdrive quickly, not a lot of headroom. Lot's of "organic" tone, if that makes sense. They also tend to be loose feeling (and sounding) compared to other designs. Black Faces have more headroom than tweeds do, and louder cleans comparatively. It's hard to describe, you need to spend a little time with them and get a feel.

What are you looking for, what type music do you play?

[Disturber]

 

[Biz Prof]

 

 

[django49]

At risk of veering off what a great TWEED amp is (relative to other Fender variations) and stipulating I love Mesa amps.......

There are some solid state amps out there that do a pretty nice take on the classic circuits. Here is a link to an amp that I like, which has  THREE classic Fender amp types (as well as V, M and D types). I offer this because they have demos all in one place of the tweed (57), blonde (61) and blackface (65) that might help illustrate the basic differences. One other nice thing about it is that it was tons of power, variable boost and a master, so the different tones can be attained at any volume.

NOT saying it is BETTER than a great tube amp, mind you.......

https://www.quilterlabs.com/products/mach-3-head

 

[Biz Prof]

While I've never owned a real deal (vintage) Fender tweed amp, I've played and recorded through several (all were late '50s) including a Bassman, Deluxe, Champ, Pro, and Princeton. All of these sound at least slightly different, but the common denominator to my ears was the lack of clean headroom at gig volumes, the somewhat crispy overdrive that got creamier as you turned the volume(s) up.  I found that the Champ, Princeton, and Deluxe got a bit farty in the low end as it got dirtier, which is related to the "sag" effect that's so often mentioned.

[crunchee]

Years ago, I had a Kendrick version of a Tweed Deluxe.  It sounded great, but the problem was that I kept maxing it out into Neil Young territory.  Nobody uses Tweeds for their headroom, because (at least on the small amps) there isn't much.  But the overdrive and distortion is glorious.  

[LucSulla]

19 hours ago, Saul Goodman said:

California Tweed looked interesting but I'm confused on what a Tweed sound is other than clean. 

Marshall's JTM45 was based of a Tweed 62 Bassman circuit, if that tells you anything. They are way, way more alike than different, and though Marshalls are known for being far dirtier amps than Fenders in general, it's not for nothing that this sound sprung out of Jim trying to clone a Bassman as closely as possible with available components in the UK in the early 60s. 

[Dutchman]

I have a 5E3 Tweed Deluxe. The controls are what most people don't understand. The volumes and tones are interactive with each other. Volume over 4 it doesn't get louder just different levels of overdrive. Dial the tone up and it's no longer in the circuit. 

My favorite is both volumes on 3. Beautiful cleans then punch the jumpered inputs with a clean boost for some nice break up. Add a distortion and it's not Metal but it's creamy rock ballad leads. 

I have an old blue alnico speaker in it also.

Hitting it with a boost really jumps the volume up. 

A nice verb pedal and a clean boost is pure heaven. Beautiful!!!  

 

 

[crunchee]

I was aware of all the 'flavors' that can be got with a Deluxe's interactive controls, but at the end of the day I still ended up maxing things out...because it was fun, and it sounded great.   Kinda like driving a Corvette to the neighborhood supermarket, using restraint will get you there safely and (hopefully) keep you from getting stopped by the cops, but it won't be nearly as much fun as driving on the open road...or as sedate as driving a Subaru.

[Saul Goodman]

On 2/10/2024 at 8:43 PM, DaveH said:

A Tweed, in my opinion, is not what you could call clean (except at lower volumes.) They tend to overdrive quickly, not a lot of headroom. Lot's of "organic" tone, if that makes sense. They also tend to be loose feeling (and sounding) compared to other designs. Black Faces have more headroom than tweeds do, and louder cleans comparatively. It's hard to describe, you need to spend a little time with them and get a feel.

What are you looking for, what type music do you play?

I love a Strat, especially the neck pickup. Sounds like a piano through the right amp. The California Tweed has a lot of headroom on the 40 watt setting for that tone. But, turn it down to 2 watts and you can get that Neil Young, "Hey, Hey, My, MY," sound from the live albums around '79 or so when I first was introduced to it. I like all those tones in between too. So I wondered what is a Tweed. I've really never thought about it and never owned a Fender amp. So I looked into the rabbit hole and found a few vids on YouTube. They said the tone can be from a Bassman, a Champ, a Blackface, and the list goes on and on. So I was more confused after seeing the videos than before. Thanks for your input along with all the others here. I guess I really like the California Tweed because it covers all the tones that you probably can't get from just one of the Fender amps on the list. At least not at all volumes. 

[Biz Prof]

I can see how the newer, modified versions of old 5E3 and 5F6-A circuits fit the bill for most rockers.  There's a lot of tweed tone on classic rock and R&B records, and most of it sounds glorious.  As for the (guitar) world's most famous tweed Deluxe ambassador Neil Young, I like some of this tones (Cinnamon Girl, Ohio, Woodstock), but the settings he favors often lean heavily toward flatulent timbres and textures.  Of course, who better to flaunt rude, flatulent amp tones than a cantankerous old fart? 

[Disturber]

On 2/11/2024 at 8:20 PM, Biz Prof said:

While I've never owned a real deal (vintage) Fender tweed amp, I've played and recorded through several (all were late '50s) including a Bassman, Deluxe, Champ, Pro, and Princeton. All of these sound at least slightly different, but the common denominator to my ears was the lack of clean headroom at gig volumes, the somewhat crispy overdrive that got creamier as you turned the volume(s) up.  I found that the Champ, Princeton, and Deluxe got a bit farty in the low end as it got dirtier, which is related to the "sag" effect that's so often mentioned.

My 1983/84 Fender Super Champ does a great Tweed impersonation, if need be. A bit tighter in the bass, which is a good thing.

[tbonesullivan]

Others have answered, but for me Tweed amps are just that early Fender sound, lots of mids, and not really a lot of headroom before you get some nice grit. They are raw sounding, and they weren't really "designed' to be overdriven, they just overdrive easily. Part of this may be due to them being designed to work with Fender guitars like the Esquire, Telecaster, and Stratocaster, the last of which was released in 1954, right around the time of the classic "tweed" design amps from Fender. Les Pauls and other Gibson guitars had hotter pickups that were pretty quick to overdrive the preamps in the Tweed amps.

Later amps such as the Brownface and Blackface had a much different tonal profile, with a lot less mids, and did not overdrive as easily. I mainly know about this as I have a bunch of Rivera amplifiers, and they have a "Notch" control on the mids of the "Fender" channel. It normally has the notch around 550hz, or "Tweed" style, but pulling it moves the mid control notch to 250hz, which is "Blackface". Also, this is a good primer:

https://reverb.com/news/the-evolution-of-fender-amps

[hamerican gigolo]

I think a lot of the tweed sound has to do with the speaker technology of the time. Those low power Jensen alnicos weren't designed for high volume, especially by modern standards. You crank up a tweed Bassman or Twin & they struggle to keep up. But, that's part of the beauty of the design. A happy accident, if you will... 😀