What amp would go best with my SATF Korean Hamer guitar?

[SongBard]

I recently bought a Used SATF-HB Hamer guitar made in Korea. This is my first electric! So, as a newbe to the world of electric guitars, I am lost where to start. I have been playing acoustic guitar for many years, and wanted to try something different.  So does it matter what style of music you want to play or the type of guitar? Do pedals enhance or compensate what the amp can't do?

Looking forward to some great conversations and learning along the way!

[Dave Scepter]

9 minutes ago, SongBard said:

I recently bought a Used SATF-HB Hamer guitar made in Korea. This is my first electric! So, as a newbe to the world of electric guitars, I am lost where to start. I have been playing acoustic guitar for many years, and wanted to try something different.  So does it matter what style of music you want to play or the type of guitar? Do pedals enhance or compensate what the amp can't do?

Looking forward to some great conversations and learning along the way!

Hi & Good morning... ^^Yes to all that^^

These days there are so many incredible and wonderful amps out there to choose from & it would help to know what type of music you play and your budget... here are some answers from a previous thread... I hope this helps

 

[cynic]

Fender Superchamp XD or X2 or whatever the current model is. Cheap, versatile, and if you find yourself wanting better it's only a $50 speaker upgrade away. 

[SongBard]

Hi Dave,

Well, as far as budget goes, I would say from middle toward high end, and am not opposed to used.

My tastes in music really varies. I like 70's Rock, Alternative, Jazz, Classical, Bollywood, World Beat, Ragas, Fusion, some popular...so with my varied taste, I'd like to be able to play Smashing Pumpkins to Jazz Standards to Led Zeplin.

[SongBard]

I should mention that I also occasionally play in an 11 piece band, so need to be able to keep up with guitars, keyboard, drums, bass and horn section! I have been using my Taylor 114ce and Taylor 816ce on a Fishman Loudbox mini 60. 

[SongBard]

Cynic, thanks for the suggestions - I'll have to test those out!

[mathman]

So I would suggest something like Amplitube 4 or Fractal Axe FX or another version of an amp sim computer based or amp based.  Then you can switch as you please.

[SongBard]

Mathman, thanks. I will check them out. Amazing what you can find on YouTube! What do you have? What do you play?

[mathman]

I have a SATX Hamer Explorer, A USA Prototype II,  an 83 Cruise Bass and a few others non Hamers and I play mostly through Ik's  Amplitube 4.  Gives me lots of options depending on what I am playing and whether it is bass or guitar.

 

[Dave Scepter]

Here ya go~ you need this!... Tone monster~ 

[Caddie]

This would be perfect!  They are both made in Asia, if both Korea and China  are considered part of Asia.

got one exactly like this if you want it, $25 includes FREE SHIPPING!, belt clip and a mitten acting as cover.

[SongBard]

I love all these suggestions, but now I am left with more questions.   You all sound like you are professionals, but I think maybe some help explaining what different features do to produce sounds for a particular style. For instance, the songs I play in the band are: 

From The Beginning- Greg Lake, Saturday in The Park-Chicago, HoHey- Lumineers, Breezin -George Benson, Eight Days A Week -Beatles, Message To You Rudy -The Specials, September -Earth Wind & Fire, Man of Constant Sorrow -Soggy Bottom Boys, Wonderful Tonight -Eric Clapton....

When I'm home I play Stairway to Heaven, Mood for a Day by Yes...  A little blues, a lot of Violent Femmes.

I guess I have a lot of research to do. I just love the sound of guitar. Reading the forums on this site is inspiring and helped me decide on the Hamer, albeit made in Korea, but baby steps!

So I'm going to listen to demos of all the suggestions and report back! 

 

 

 

 

[scottcald]

Another question I'd have is how close to replicating all those sounds do you need to get?  You can go the full amp/pedal route.  Don't discount a good modeling system like the Line6 products or Boss GT series or the Kemper at the high end.  They all have digital modeling of known amps and effects and also can make your electric sound like an acoustic.  Some folks like looking for the next amp/pedal combinations and switching that stuff out etc.  I like the convenience the modeling technology. gives.   Hope that's helpful.   

Great list of songs, by the way.  September is an awesome song.  Hard not to feel good after hearing that. 

[gorch]

The modeling options give you a wide array of sounds to capture the wide array of songs you play. Any of the named are great and provide more than you'll ever need. However, this solutions don't provide an amp. In case you have a mixer, monitoring, and PA in the band room, it's alright.

To stay alive in a 11 piece band on your own, you'd probably need a 25 watt tube amp that has a master volume that is going to amplify one of the modding pre-amps mentioned above.

For home playing it just needs a stereo with a line in or a little amp with say 0.5 - 4 watt.

Btw. You could also play through your smartphone. On iPhone there would be Garageband i.e. The iRig would connect you. It's just another option for home playing, but also for the band setting into the mixer.

Don't worry, the world if electric guitar is wide. Simply make a decision and start at one point up until you are happy. You can easily flip stuff around. We are all in the same boat. 

Oh, and in essence a tube or transistor based amp, a compressor and an overdrive pedal would do the trick also. I had one of these. http://www.ebay.com/itm/B-Stock-Fender-Princeton-Recording-Tube-Guitar-Combo-Amplifier-/201679073048?hash=item2ef5026f18:g:~8AAAOSw4shX7Tcy. They pop up here and there and might be cheaper than this one. It comes with a line out to allow connection to a mixer while it would serve you as PA. Very versatile this one.

[mrjamiam]

Hi SongBard, and welcome!  Looking at the examples you've given, it seems like nothing you're playing requires an enormous amount of gain, so I'd lean toward an amp that does nice cleans up to moderate crunch, and get any higher-gain sounds (like for some leads) with a pedal.  That said, there are options upon options out there.  There are members here who play out all the time who would have some great recommendations based on current experience.  I just fool around at home.

Some considerations are:  amp vs. computer (which is what the modeling solutions really are - the AxeFX and Kemper and Line6 and so forth), which would entail limited options/complexity vs. unlimited options/complexity.  If you are determined to very nearly exactly reproduce an array of sounds, modeling might be the way to go, especially if you have the interest and patience to weed through piles of variables.  If you are satisfied with the variations you can get from gain and tone knobs and your hands, an amp could be a lot simpler (and maybe cheaper, or maybe not).

In amps, tube vs. transistor.  Tube amps get much love, but they have some peculiarities that transistor amps don't.  If you like the sound from a transistor amp, you can basically dial it louder or softer as required and get the same sound, up to the point where the speaker starts to distort.  A tube amp sounds different at different volumes, according to whether the tubes are being driven to (or past) the point where they start to distort.  Distortion is kind of the point to an amp, especially a tube amp, but there are different sources of distortion - preamp, power amp, speaker - and they have different characteristics.  A master volume on a tube amp can often be thought of as a way to force the distortion toward the preamp section, which may or may not be what you want.  You can generally vary the sound more through your hands (mostly via your pick attack) with a tube amp.

Power available.  This is the wattage figure.  Tube amps are generally louder at the same stated wattage capability than transistor amps.  So, if you're used to playing a 60 watt transistor amp and someone suggests a 25 watt tube amp as an option, don't think that it will necessarily be quieter.  A lot of times the point of a low-wattage amp (like a 5-watter) is to be played at some level of distortion all the time.  The purpose of some high-wattage amps (like a Fender Twin Reverb) is to be able to play it loud with very little distortion, i.e. high headroom.  As always there are lots of variables.

Tube amps have tubes, of course.  Tubes can and sometimes must be changed.  Different tubes can give you variations on sound.  Tubes fail and have to be replaced - not constantly, but if you play a tube amp regularly for years you'll end up changing the power tubes a few times and the preamp tubes occasionally.  And you should have spares with you at gigs.  In general, you should be prepared to learn more about a tube amp's insides and the way it operates than you would need to know about a transistor amp.

Happy hunting!

 

eta P.S. - I meant to add that if this is your first electric guitar, realize that it's equipped with humbucking (twin-coil) pickups.  You might want to consider also getting a single-coil pickup-equipped guitar (Stratocaster and Telecaster types are classics but by no means the only options), particularly for songs where you want a clean, ringing sound.

[SongBard]

So far, checking out the Fender Super Champ XD and X2 models. They seem similar.  One of several helpful videos http://youtu.be/4Dc3E4OxKWI shows four amps that really helped me distinguish sound differences. Leaning toward the Fender Super Champ XD but a little concerned on the volume. Upgrading the speaker is definitely a great option. (Thanks cynic!) 

Also, tube sound is SWEET!  So what is bias, and how does that affect things?

 

[Jakeboy]

Welcome to the best guitar forum on the Web! Spend some time here, you'll dig it. 

'You need a versatile amp that will give you good cleans, overdrive, some distortion and be able to keep up with an 11 piece band.....so many good choices out there depending upon budget...

Here are three recommendations from me:

1. LIl Dawg Ol Yeller 6g6b Blonde Bassman clone...does cleans , OD , and distortion and you will be heard. The Blondes were awesome....

2. Mesa TA15...I just picked one up off this board and am still amazed...this tiny lunchbox gives you Vox, Marshall, Fender, and Mesa tones and is switchable from 5 to 25 watts so it is loud enough for your needs.

3. A Marshall JTM 45 or clone thereof...gorgeous cleans and classic dirt too.

It all depends upon what tones hit your ears and make you happy. You really need to plug in and play and figure out what you like in your electric tone. I have the 6g6b and the Mesa (and others) currently and I did own the JTM45. If you lived close I would break out all my amps and let you play them....maybe you need to find someone or a really well-stocked store close to where you live and run that zHamer through a bunch....one of them will put a smile on your face. But it really seems to me you need something versatile, based upon your statements....and it needs to have enough wattage to keep up with that band, unless you can put it in the PA....

[mrjamiam]

3 hours ago, SongBard said:

Also, tube sound is SWEET!  So what is bias, and how does that affect things?

 

The topic of bias gets into the nitty-gritty of how tubes operate.  There is endless information on the internet to match whatever level of detail you want, but here is a summary of what I think are the two main aspects of as it relates to tube amps that doesn't delve into much detail of how electronic circuits operate:  

Bias refers to the necessary voltage level to supply to a tube to set it into its operating range.  There are various ways that the amp designer can choose to supply this voltage, but the main two for guitar amps are referred to as cathode bias and "fixed" bias.  I put "fixed" in quotes, because it really is variable.

Without getting into much detail about the inner workings, cathode bias refers to one way of wiring a tube socket into a circuit that is the way that a large majority of preamp tubes are wired, and some power tubes.  The classic Vox amps, for instance, have their power tubes wired in cathode bias.  There is no adjustment involved with cathode bias; just replace a tube, if desired or necessary.

"Fixed" bias is a different way of wiring the tube socket into a circuit.  When this way is used, natural variations between tubes as they come off the production line come into play.  A tube "wants" to see a certain voltage on one of its pins in order to do its job of amplifying the signal that passes through it.  This voltage can vary somewhat within a small range, from the "cold" side (low voltage/current) to the "hot" side (high voltage/current).  Many amps that are designed with fixed bias power tubes are equipped with a component that allows a technician to vary a resistance to adjust the voltage/current supplied to the tube, for the purpose of putting the tube into an operating range where it provides good sound.  If it's too far to the "cold" side, the sound will be thin.  Too far to the "hot" side, and while it may sound good to some ears, the tube will be used up very quickly.  When replacing a tube in a fixed bias circuit, the new tube might operate too hot or too cold at the setting the previous tube thought was just right, and the tech needs to make the adjustment to make the new tube happy and long-lived.  This type of set-up usually occurs in amps that use power tubes in pairs, and for best operation the pairs should be matched so that they are operating with similar voltage/current levels.

So, in a fixed bias amp, the bias must be adjusted so that the amp sounds good with the tubes that are installed, and so that they last for a reasonable lifespan.  There is a bit of room to adjust the sound to taste, as well.

All else being equal (which it never really is), a fixed bias power tube amp will sound louder and cleaner than a cathode bias power tube amp.  The cathode bias output tube amp is often referred to as sounding "sweeter", because it distorts in a slightly different way.

I hope that helps.  Google is your friend.

[Caddie]

mrjamiam,  nice.  Clear, succinct, explanation.  Ya don't need a degree in Electrical Engineering to figure it out.  Well done. 

[Steve Haynie]

Find a local music store and try out amps there.

[Dave Scepter]

Here's another choice... I prefer heads as opposed to combos as you can pick and choose the speaker combination of your choice, whether it be a 1× 12, 2×12 or a 4×12... open, closed back, ported, Theil cabinets... LOTS of options and much easier to transport as well... 

[Caddie]

4 hours ago, Steve Haynie said:

Find a local music store and try out amps there.

No non-stop tuning with harmonics or fretting.  Ask "May I try out a Snark?"

There's usually a sign "Stairway" people will be asked to leave. 

caddie

[SongBard]

On October 16, 2016 at 3:08 AM, scottcald said:

Another question I'd have is how close to replicating all those sounds do you need to get?  You can go the full amp/pedal route.  Don't discount a good modeling system like the Line6 products or Boss GT series or the Kemper at the high end.  They all have digital modeling of known amps and effects and also can make your electric sound like an acoustic.  Some folks like looking for the next amp/pedal combinations and switching that stuff out etc.  I like the convenience the modeling technology. gives.   Hope that's helpful.   

Great list of songs, by the way.  September is an awesome song.  Hard not to feel good after hearing that. 

Thanks scottcald!  Great advice. I did check out Line6, Blackstar, and Boss. Have to say I am loving the Boss Katana 100/2x12. It sounds really good, I can use it for practice or gigs, the clean settings are awesome and there are so many selections. One of the best features is that I can also use my acoustic guitars and be able to add affects to it. No lugging two amps - although a little heavy at 43 pounds, I can build a custom dolly for it and to hold the rest of my gear, too.  Definitely a top contender. 👍

 

 

 

 

 

[scottcald]

They do have a 50 watt that's only about 25 pounds.  Haven't tried the Katana in person, but it looks cool.  

[SongBard]

To everyone, really, thanks for all the great replies! I am still checking out your suggestions...this is a great web site!

Jakeboy, mrjamian, gorch and Dave Scepter:

Thanks for the welcome! You were dead on summing up the scenarios for what I might need. I think many future visitors will learn a lot from your replies. I feel like I just went through amp 101 boot camp! So helpful when checking out the demos. Bias explanation was exceptional - appreciate the time you spent on that! 

I think digital is where I am leaning and price point of $500 or so is what I am comfortable with to start. I play by ear, so I noticed right away the sound differences between the single coil and humbucker pickups.  Maybe there's a strat in my future....

Caddie, your posts make me smile! Keep 'em coming!

I will try a few out to narrow down the list (thanks Steve Haynie) and will post my top five with the reasons.🎸

[tomteriffic]

On 10/16/2016 at 10:27 AM, SongBard said:

So far, checking out the Fender Super Champ XD and X2 models. They seem similar.  One of several helpful videos http://youtu.be/4Dc3E4OxKWI shows four amps that really helped me distinguish sound differences. Leaning toward the Fender Super Champ XD but a little concerned on the volume. Upgrading the speaker is definitely a great option. (Thanks cynic!) 

Also, tube sound is SWEET!  So what is bias, and how does that affect things?

 

The SuperChamp X2 is the current model.  It has a USB interface built-in, allowing you tweak settings to taste from your computer.  Otherwise, it's the same as the XD.  I play a wide variety of stuff in a variety of settings and my XD can cover them all up to  a certain volume limit.  But that limit is surprisingly high with the Eminence.

THE speaker upgrade for this is the Eminence Ragin' Cajun.  Better lows, smoother highs and significantly greater sensitivity (more sound out for fewer watts in.  It's louder)

Bias, in simple terms, is a small amount of current necessary to get the tube operating within its performance envelope or design parameters.  For an amplifier newbie, it's not of that much concern.  However (within its range) lower bias=cleaner sound and longer tube life.  Higher bias= earlier onset of distortion, warmer sound, potentially shorter tube life.  Fender typically biases it's tubes to the lower side of the range.