MTM105 Posted February 11, 2007 Posted February 11, 2007 I bought a 81 Hamer Special in 1987 due to the fact that word of mouth claimed it was better than the famous Gibby LP. I was living in Army barracks at the time, and I sensed owning a LP would bring criminals out of the woodwork wanting to steal it, so I felt safer with Hamer.I played this guitar for 2 decades now. I don't own a LP, and haven't played one in recent memory to recall any comparison. To my knowledge, and I am aware this has been discussed measurably, but I believe the Hamer Special scale is modeled after Fender Stratocaster. If that is the case, the guitar wold be marketed as built like a LP, plays like a Strat.I messed up formatting the poll. It's probably not that important, anyway.....The poll would read110%100%90%75%etc...
edgar_allan_poe Posted February 11, 2007 Posted February 11, 2007 A Hamer Special is short scale and not 25.5 like a Strat.The guitars are apples and oranges though. The build quality of the Hamer is better IMHO, but the design is way different. The Specials have more in common with a LP Special than a real LP. Think about it...LP1. Single cut2. Maple cap...not a laminate3. Thicker bodyThe Hamer doesn't share any of those characteristics.
Luke Posted February 11, 2007 Posted February 11, 2007 While people will always say only a Les Paul sounds like a Les Paul, the truth is there is so much variation from one to another that the statement is at best a generality. It is always amazing what people claim to hear, but when push comes to shove and they are forced to blind test using clips they are only right 50% of the time.Tone is the end result of the guitar, wiring, amplifier, amplifier settings, speakers, speaker cabinet, etc. You can adjust the tone controls of the amp normally, so it is usually possible to get a very similar sound if one tries to do so.I would say they are 75% similar and can be made to sound far closer with a reasonable amount of knob turning.
Kurt L Posted February 11, 2007 Posted February 11, 2007 These threads are always fun since there seems to be an assumption that there is a "Les Paul sound" - and that Les Pauls sound alike and offer something no other guitar can.I've had four Les Pauls and they all sounded different. Similar, but distinctly different. So to me, the "Les Paul sound" is a ballpark - and a Hamer Special FM or Studio will definitely get you there.
princeofdarkness56 Posted February 11, 2007 Posted February 11, 2007 Two different animals if you ask me. Not so much tone wise, but style, balance and weight. I have had both. A 79 LP and a 81 Special. The LP is long gone but the Special is still here. That LP was a beauty but it weighed a ton and was very uncomfortable. I could get the same tone from the Hamer without the neck and shoulder pain and that became my number 1.
kizanski Posted February 11, 2007 Posted February 11, 2007 I've had many Les Pauls and at least 10 times as many Specials.They Are NOT alike - period.The Sustain Block bridge is the biggest difference, but that's not the end of it.As for the dual 'bucker, tune-o-matic guitars, they are in the "Close, but no Cigar" category (which is not listed).
Guest pirateflynn Posted February 11, 2007 Posted February 11, 2007 I agree with the members who ask, "Which LP sound"? My Sunbursts give up LP tones and to a lesser degree so does my '79 Standard. Maybe someday I'll get another LP but I don't think so.... I don't need one.
Jeff R Posted February 11, 2007 Posted February 11, 2007 I'll echoplex the choir here. Different sound and feel. Me and Cajun Boy did an A/B with his tricked out Studio Custom last week and an '81 LP Standard I'm babysitting for a military buddy who's overseas. Ran them through his Bogner halfstack and then his SF Super Reverb and some stompboxes.The SC was more comfortable to play on your body and more articulate (light tone woods and ebony board surely helped this I'm sure). The '81 Standard had a boomier bass tone. The two factors I'd first point to at are the thicker body and then (just my opinion) the extra mass (wood) on the bass side of the neck from the 16th fret up.Was either one better? Not necessarily. Get what makes you happy for your ears, fingers, eyes and back (this is a LP-related thread after all).FYI, I've owned two '72 Customs, a '79 Standard, an '82 30th Anniversary Standard, and an '84 Custom and played countless others (all my buddies were LP players in the 90s) and all LPs are different tonally in some regard in my opinion. Maybe because their weights are all over the board - the '82 30th was a featherweight and the '79 Standard clocked in the whopping 13-14 pound range. The Studio Customs I've owned (one) and played (several) were much more consistent overall.I'd take the LP for its tones (especially for rock), typically stoopid low action and "the look." I'd take an SC for playing comfort, tonal versatility and bang-for-the-buck factor.
MTM105 Posted February 11, 2007 Author Posted February 11, 2007 My bad for not clarifying the LP Jr. Don't really see that guitar around too often with marquee names.I like what Keith Urban is doing with the LP model. His performance on SNL last night was short of amazing. He is probably the next Springsteen. I'm no big fan....but I watched SRV at Austin this week and his performance after he cleaned up was kinda short of his first performance; when he was "using", but he appeared much happier. I doubt if Urban has 1/2 the problems SRV did.
kizanski Posted February 11, 2007 Posted February 11, 2007 I like what Keith Urban is doing with the LP model. His performance on SNL last night was short of amazing. He is probably the next Springsteen.Now you're talking about Les Paul Juniors. Apples & Oranges again, even within the Les Paul family...I was very impressed with his playing on SNL, even moreso that he was soloing while singing. I have to hand it to anyone that can do either well. Do them at the same time and you're miles above anything that Springsteen ever did, IMO.That said, since he's obviously a very talented player, did he really need THREE guitar players on stage along with him? That's something you can almost defend if the front man only holds the guitar in front of him to strum every once in a while, but this guy is clearly not that type of player.
MTM105 Posted February 11, 2007 Author Posted February 11, 2007 Now you're talking about Les Paul Juniors. Apples & Oranges again, even within the Les Paul family...That said, since he's obviously a very talented player, did he really need THREE guitar players on stage along with him? I was afraid to call it a Jr. That is where I get confused....I've got literature on it, but if I recall first the Jr. was released that looked like what the Hamer Special looks like, then the LP style Jr. I wonder if Urban plays it for its sound; or is it just good marketing playing something a little different?It seems like Urban is trying to please everyone by having so many guitarists. It's not like he's playing Lynyrd Skynyrd.I realize this is probably the 1000th thread comparing Hamer to LPs.
kizanski Posted February 11, 2007 Posted February 11, 2007 Two words.Washburn. Idol. Pilsen.Isn't that three words?
Gino Posted February 11, 2007 Posted February 11, 2007 I think with the 'Les Paul sound' it's kinda like the 'PAF sound'. There are many, many different variations, but there is the ball park. From what my ears hear (and due to the fact that I've been around for a while and worked in a music store for ten years having the chance to play and hear quite a few Les Pauls and 'paulesques') I'd say that my FM Special is definitely in that ball park. Despite the fact that there are (obvious) differences - single vs. double cut, thicker body, there are a number of similarities in construction that outweight the differences. Mahagony neck and body, maple top, scale, pu-config and tom / stoptail. I find that Hamers are inherently 'brighter' than your average Les Paul and have less bottom. If you want to get closer to the (average - see above!) Les Paul sound, choosing pups can be a way to go. WCRs did that to my FM Special. I personally do believe that the wood used makes more of a difference than shape or body 'volume'. That is my experience with different Gibson Les Pauls. The difference for example between an early 70s LP Deluxe (fitted with standard HBs) with sandwich body and maple neck against a nice LP Standard might be bigger than the difference between the Standard and say a Hamer Studio. My 0.01 Cent (EURcent that is ) of insight. Gino
HamerHokie Posted February 11, 2007 Posted February 11, 2007 From what others have said here, I would say the Hamer that sounds most like an LP is the Monaco Elite.
Lockbody Posted February 11, 2007 Posted February 11, 2007 Due to the larger amount of mahogany and maple, I think my Standard Custom comes closer to nailing the LP sound than my Studio ever did.
Sentinel Posted February 11, 2007 Posted February 11, 2007 From what others have said here, I would say the Hamer that sounds most like an LP is the Monaco Elite.Yep, true - imo! I bought a Monaco Elite after having tried a BUNCH of Gibby LP's not finding ANY that felt or played or sounded as good as an Elite!!I have since then also got a Special FM and a Newport Pro.... and as a matter of fact ALL my Hamer's sounds in different ways slightly like a standard Les Paul... Btw... you could take an Elite and play it through some really rough sounding fuzz or dist pedal - i e slightly ruining the sound of the Hamer - and get a VERY close likeness to the gibby sound. But at the end of the day... when you own a Monaco Elite your gas for Gibby's will end. I Love my Elite!! :-)PS A lot of these (LP) discussions will end the day MOST of you here get yourself an Elite of your own! It seems (one can read between the lines in the posts) like as if very few HFC'rs owns Elites... It's a pity. Because the guitar is AmAzInG !
DavidE Posted February 12, 2007 Posted February 12, 2007 From what others have said here, I would say the Hamer that sounds most like an LP is the Monaco Elite.Yep, true - imo! I bought a Monaco Elite after having tried a BUNCH of Gibby LP's not finding ANY that felt or played or sounded as good as an Elite!!I have since then also got a Special FM and a Newport Pro.... and as a matter of fact ALL my Hamer's sounds in different ways slightly like a standard Les Paul... Btw... you could take an Elite and play it through some really rough sounding fuzz or dist pedal - i e slightly ruining the sound of the Hamer - and get a VERY close likeness to the gibby sound. But at the end of the day... when you own a Monaco Elite your gas for Gibby's will end. I Love my Elite!! :-)PS A lot of these (LP) discussions will end the day MOST of you here get yourself an Elite of your own! It seems (one can read between the lines in the posts) like as if very few HFC'rs owns Elites... It's a pity. Because the guitar is AmAzInG !I own a great Monaco Elite. Chambered with WCRs. Great guitar. Still wanted an LP. Got an Edwards. ;-)
Craig S Posted February 12, 2007 Posted February 12, 2007 85% there... Definately a humbucker/mahogany tone.. Sustain block Specials have the bridge pickup closer to the bridge which changes were the strings vibrate over the pup's. Body mass is obviously less... I think a Standard will get you closer... My Specials have all been lighter sonding than my Pauls... More beef than my SG's less than the Pauls. Both sound good in there own right and close enough in tone to satisfy most..
Craig Posted February 12, 2007 Posted February 12, 2007 Luke hit the nail on the head. I'll refer you to his answer, except I'll change his 75% to 99%. Oh, and if you ask the lay person, almost all guitars run through the same rig sound almost exactly alike.
Citrus Posted February 12, 2007 Posted February 12, 2007 Forget the guitar, it's the player - the hands!!!I've heard a guy with a fender strat, and a fender deluxe absolutely nail Duane Almman @ the fillmore tonedidn't need WCRs, Lollars, Bumble Bee caps, a Darkburst re-issue 58 Les Paul, Tone Pros etc.Do the above after market devices make the guitar sound better - I think hell yes!!It's been said before, most of the tone is in the hands!!Oh yeah, the guy who was able to do it Lee Roy Parnell - country playerBuy the guitar you fell most comfortable with and practice practice practice!I wonder if those ( sorry if I offend ) on TGP would play an ugly guitar that wasn't a Gibby Burst if it absolutely nailed their favorite LP PAF sound. May have gone off base a little here, but I think more of the sound ( tone) is in the hands than the mahog + maple.Wail on Skydog!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
tbabinec Posted February 12, 2007 Posted February 12, 2007 Sentine1 +1! I love my Monaco Elite (love my Artist too). Iput in SD Antiquity Humbuckers and that did the trick for me.Can get crunch, pinch harmonics, and a host of tones.
Matt Mattson Posted February 12, 2007 Posted February 12, 2007 Forget the guitar, it's the player - the hands!!!Personally, I don't know why we constantly try to get a Gibson tone and then say Gibson is crap -- for me, I like my Studio better than the LP. I certainly would play a 335 more than the LP because I play it more than the Studio (and I like its sound much better than the LP too). There you have it, total confusion.
Brewmaster Posted February 12, 2007 Posted February 12, 2007 I had a 98 P-90 Goldtop that was the most LP sounding of any Hamer I have owned. It compared to the 54 and 56 P-90 loaded LPs. I still regret having to sell it, it was a freak, one of a kind. My Mahogany Studio, loaded with Pearly Gates is close. Very Billy Gibbonsesque but then again, anything I play through my 18 watt Marshall clone sounds like the Rev without trying.
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