Has eBay lost is 'sparkle'?

[Willie G. Moseley]

I pretty had to sign up for eBay in 2003, to sell some gear because I had lost my day job. I found the concept to be intriguing at times, and would occasionally all hot n' bothered about something I really coveted. If I won it, I felt a type of personal sense of accomplishment or elation, if I didn't win, I actually seemed to pout for a short time (but kept it to myself).

Most of the time when I've sold stuff, it's been for more than I probably would have gotten at a guitar show or consignment to a vintage store...but there's also been the added facet of shipping, and making good on something if it's damaged, which has happened a couple of times.

I think the eBay commercial that showed women and men on a football field battling over a vase that's up for auction is on the money concerning the attitude of many participants.

But recently I've gotten a bit tired of trying to do business this way, and perhaps it's primarily been due to an ongoing mess where I won something about 45 days ago and sent a USPS money order. I didn't have enough funds in my PayPal account, and my personal policy is not to add funds from an outside source to PayPal---eBay alone ought to be able to carry it (but I realize not every eBay participant would take such a tack). The m.o. has apparently been lost in the mail, and the seller is patiently waiting while the Post Office investigates.

That being said, it's obvious that I don't like eBay's policy of PayPal only, and if the amount of an auction is more than I have in PayPal, I inquire if the seller will take a USPS m.o. The ones that will take a money order is about three-to-one over those that won't.

Between eBay's "PayPal only" policy being established, recent promotions (that pop up between log in and My Summary) and other annoyances (including shipping, but that's technically not eBay's domain), I've gotten kinda put off with this type of buying and selling. A couple of weeks ago, I passed through a town where one of my favorite vintage stores is located, and I consigned a bass that I would normally have put up on eBay, just to see what would happen. I can always get it back (when I'm back in the area after the standard consignment time expires) and put it on internet auction but I'm just kinda stepping back from that.

Which begs the question if anyone else has gotten tired (or "fed up", and there's a difference in the terms) with dealing with eBay and is reverting---if only as an experiment---back to some other way of buying and selling in an egalitarian manner.

Comments?

[MCChris]

Which begs the question if anyone else has gotten tired (or "fed up", and there's a difference in the terms) with dealing with eBay

<raises hand>

I wised up a long time ago. Welcome to civilization, Willie!

[Turdus]

Ebay's not going anywhere. The machine will only get bigger. I always attempt to sell locally first via Craigslist. When that does not work, or I get fed up with offers of about 25% of the already below market value Turdus price, it's off to Ebay.

Case in point... 2 vintage Pearl cymbal stands:

I offered them locally @ $15 for the pair. No bites

Listed on Ebay with starting price of $15. Final sale price was somewhere around $130 + shipping.

[diablo175]

Which begs the question if anyone else has gotten tired (or "fed up", and there's a difference in the terms) with dealing with eBay and is reverting---if only as an experiment---back to some other way of buying and selling in an egalitarian manner.

Comments?

I might not be the best respondent given the recent lambasting I brought on for my rant against PayPal, but I can't resist. I should also qualify this (lest I incur the wrath of business people) that I do not make a living selling goods or services thru the internet.

That being said, I've been to both ends of the spectrum re: eBay. Loved it for some great deals I've scored on there and loathed it for some questionable policies and personally annoying characteristics. It is most definitely a love/hate thing, depending on the time and the nature of the latest transaction made on it. But I heartily agree that eBay's luster has been long fading and I have found myself frustrated that there are few other options to replace it. Forums are a decent alternative if you know and are known by the members. Craig'sList doesn't have nearly the success rate because of the limited area of coverage. Fact is, eBay has established a stranglehold on the market because it was arguably the first, now the biggest and best at what it does. We as consumers (or part-time business people) have the option to go other routes. But until there are other equally successful venues available to us, we will be at the mercy of eBay and all it's policies.

[edgar_allan_poe]

I still use it for certain things.

Example...

I just bought two pairs of shoes. Both were $300+ Mephisto loafers. Thats $600 worth of shoes. No way I can afford that. I go to ebay and find them for a grand total of $130...for both. Both were from sellers with 10K transactions and zero negative feedback. I felt comfortable with that and got a great deal on some spectacular shoes that were brand new in the box.

I'll also look for high end clothing from reputable sellers from time to time. I have received some great deals. I do not buy from individuals on ebay, I stick with the stores.

[elduave]

Ebay's not going anywhere. The machine will only get bigger. I always attempt to sell locally first via Craigslist. When that does not work, or I get fed up with offers of about 25% of the already below market value Turdus price, it's off to Ebay.

Case in point... 2 vintage Pearl cymbal stands:

I offered them locally @ $15 for the pair. No bites

Listed on Ebay with starting price of $15. Final sale price was somewhere around $130 + shipping.

I would have come picked them up!

[MCChris]

we will be at the mercy of eBay and all it's policies.

This is the mindset that allows eBay to be what it is. My guess is that the vast majority of people who conduct business on there do so not out of necessity but to get their kicks by wheeling, dealing and getting bargains. This is particularly true of music hobbyists who are buying and selling pure luxury items. Very few people need a new guitar, amp or pedal. If people would conquer their obsession with shuffling shit around via an internet auction site, they'd be at the mercy of no one.

[elduave]

I might not be the best respondent given the recent lambasting I brought on for my rant against PayPal, but I can't resist. I should also qualify this (lest I incur the wrath of business people) that I do not make a living selling goods or services thru the internet.

It aint only business people. Just be decent, and most folks will be decent to you. Need I remind people of the public lambasting of that FB I sold you, and cryptically at that, when you know I'm on the board?

Sorry to derail your thread Willie.

[jwhitcomb3]

Living in a very small city in a small state, there are lots of items that I could neither buy nor sell locally. Batteries for 10 year old synths. Parts for an out of production vacuum. I've had one bad ebay transaction out of hundreds, which is a better percentage than I've had with brick and morter retailers.

I think it comes down to common sense. If a deal seems too good to be true, it probably is. If the seller is a new ebayer, I factor that into my bidding. If the ad copy is snarky, or if the seller doesn't answer questions, I don't bid. I generally buy within the USA.

[atquinn]

...Comments?

Given your story, it should be obvious to you why eBay prefers that PayPal be used. You don't have to add money to your account to use PayPal, just use a credit card. Otherwise, instead of being at the mercy of the PP, you get to be at the mercy of the USPS, and have fun with that. Meanwhile, the seller in this case gets screwed and maybe you do too if he decides to just sell his item to someone else instead of waiting for your money to get to him (which he would be well within his rights to do).

Anyway, I have no problem with eBay. I use it to buy and sell stuff and haven't been screwed over yet in the many years I have used it. I can certainly understand why people don't use it, but I don't get the angst. Don't like it? Don't use it and move on. But please don't be silly enough to suggest that there is any real alternative selling venue out there that does what eBay does.

-Austin

[Armitage]

I still think it's funny people say they "won" on eBay, when in reality, they were just willing to pay more for the item, then the billions of other people in the world were.

[MCChris]

I still think it's funny people say they "won" on eBay, when in reality, they were just willing to pay more for the item, then the billions of other people in the world were.

That's a subtle part of its success. Same way MySpace initially succeeded and Facebook continues to succeed by measuring the amount of "friends" someone has. It's really a brilliant way to tap into society's collective psyche.

[atquinn]

I still think it's funny people say they "won" on eBay, when in reality, they were just willing to pay more for the item, then the billions of other people in the world were.

I mostly agreed with you. But there are clearly cases where a saavy buyer can "win" something on eBay. A "Hammer Guitar" that just happens to be a Watson listed at a BIN of $550 for example. Or in cases where the auction doesn't get the attention it otherwise would if the pictures were better or not enough information was given, or it ended at a strange time, or wasn't listed for very many days. So, yes, the whole "winning" thing is a bit silly and the competitive angle is certainly a part of eBay's (and auctions in general) success, but there are ways you can get an item below "market value" on eBay.

-Austin

[Frank]

I still think it's funny people say they "won" on eBay, when in reality, they were just willing to pay more for the item, then the billions of other people in the world were.

That's not just an eBay thing. I've always heard people talk about winning something at an auction - when in fact they bought it. I don't know if it's still around or not, but before I did anything on eBay, I used to buy stuff on Ubid. Now there's some new site advertising on TV - I think it's Beezid? So there are other places out there, eBay has just been the most successful so far. I've mostly had good luck on eBay. I've bought quite a good bit of stuff and only gotten bit once, and that was really my fault because I didn't contact the seller and complain about the piece I bought.

I'm afraid that the policies that we don't like on eBay are most likely not eBay's fault, but the fault of the people who refuse to conduct business ethically and they would be there in any type of selling venue. The internet just makes it easier for them. They eventually get found out and kicked off, but they are the ones who cause a lot of the policies that chafe the rest of us. YMMV.

[diablo175]

I still think it's funny people say they "won" on eBay, when in reality, they were just willing to pay more for the item, then the billions of other people in the world were.

I mostly agreed with you. But there are clearly cases where a saavy buyer can "win" something on eBay. A "Hammer Guitar" that just happens to be a Watson listed at a BIN of $550 for example. Or in cases where the auction doesn't get the attention it otherwise would if the pictures were better or not enough information was given, or it ended at a strange time, or wasn't listed for very many days. So, yes, the whole "winning" thing is a bit silly and the competitive angle is certainly a part of eBay's (and auctions in general) success, but there are ways you can get an item below "market value" on eBay.

-Austin

Jeez, I hate myself when I fall into that trap. I've been sucked in to competitive bidding on several occasions in the past. Like Austin, I have scored some great deals (a near mint Diablo with active pup's pro installed for 300 bucks.) which only served to perpetuate the competitive bidding from me. Until I just said, "no more." That was one mean monkey to get off the back.

[Thundernotes]

When I was churning through 4 or 5 guitars and basses a year, ebay was my crack-house. I do still occasionally buy something there, but it seems now that I gig heavily, the thrill of new acquisition isn't necessary. I'd much rather buy and sell here on this board than anywhere.

[jwhitcomb3]

I'd much rather buy and sell here on this board than anywhere.

+1

[Devnor]

Lost it long ago. Seems like ebay is packed full of cheapie freebie listings for things like roll-out plastic pianos and stuff esp in the pro audio section. Just tons of junk. Yeah I remember winning items on ebay but this was long ago before there was online sniping sites and the proliferation of the home based ebay business. I still buy some pro audio things on ebay...just got a Yamaha synth from Pixar that arrived broken (I was able to fix it). Currently looking for a compressor something like an MC77. Almost got burned on GS so that's out...where else do you get this kind of stuff?

Went thru the ringer trying to sell a Motif synth and Boogie Stiletto earlier this year on craigslist and on various forums. Spent months trying to move that gear but it sold for more than I was asking locally when I posted it on the bay. Ebay still has it's uses but I don't like using it.

[Feynman]

I like eBay and PayPal. I also dislike them. Overall, though, I like them quite a bit.

Being able to find obscure things or even non-obscure things is a breeze. Even with their cut (over 10% combined sometimes), I have made more money with my eBay sales than I have on Craigslist or forums (if I even get a response on those).

I have had two d-bag experiences since 1998 when I joined eBay, and I think that's not too bad. In both cases, eBay (once) and PayPal (once) listened to reason and everything resolved nicely in my favor. I'm sure I may get burned someday, but overall I feel good about the protections, ease of use, large market, etc of eBay.

I think everyone on Phoenix Craigslist is a crack-smokin' 4th grader, except me of course.

For guitars and such, the HFC is my preferred shopping venue. Outside of that, eBay has been good to me.

[cynic]

My experience is similar to Fenyman's. I rarely use it for anything expensive, but I've kept a pretty steady rotation, buying and selling 2 or 3 cheaper guitars a year to try the various shapes and styles I don't have in my nicer things. I could probably do much of what I do with regular trips to GC, but this way I get to play with them longer and if I run across one that plays well I can try a few things to see if it's worth keeping.

For the obscurities it's worth it's weight in gold. 9 times out of 10 if you can think of something it can be found there.

I've also learned many people don't even search elsewhere. When looking for a "pass the pigs" game maybe 7 years ago, I saw them selling on ebay for $15 and up. At the same time, Amazon was selling them for $7.99. I bought four to get the free shipping from Amazon, kept the one I wanted and listed the remaining three on ebay for $0.99. I ended up nearly doubling my $25 and had a "free" game to boot.

I don't have the level of sanity (insanty?) required to make a habit of finding weird things to sell on ebay, but there have been numerous times that I've been happy someone else does.

[diablo175]

My experience is similar to Fenyman's. I rarely use it for anything expensive, but I've kept a pretty steady rotation, buying and selling 2 or 3 cheaper guitars a year to try the various shapes and styles I don't have in my nicer things. I could probably do much of what I do with regular trips to GC, but this way I get to play with them longer and if I run across one that plays well I can try a few things to see if it's worth keeping.

For the obscurities it's worth it's weight in gold. 9 times out of 10 if you can think of something it can be found there.

I've also learned many people don't even search elsewhere. When looking for a "pass the pigs" game maybe 7 years ago, I saw them selling on ebay for $15 and up. At the same time, Amazon was selling them for $7.99. I bought four to get the free shipping from Amazon, kept the one I wanted and listed the remaining three on ebay for $0.99. I ended up nearly doubling my $25 and had a "free" game to boot.

I don't have the level of sanity (insanty?) required to make a habit of finding weird things to sell on ebay, but there have been numerous times that I've been happy someone else does.

+1. I found a brand new BC Rich at Amazon for dirt cheap- cheaper than several used one's on the Bay.

[BCR Greg]

Nobody so far has stated that they prefer to buy from Mom and Pop stores like mine and Dave's.

When we are gone, you guys will rail about how unfair it is that we went down.

[MCChris]

Nobody so far has stated that they prefer to buy from Mom and Pop stores like mine and Dave's.

When we are gone, you guys will rail about how unfair it is that we went down.

That's because you guys don't sell stuff for "dirt cheap," which seems to be the no. 1 priority for purchasers in the digital age.

[atquinn]

Nobody so far has stated that they prefer to buy from Mom and Pop stores like mine and Dave's.

When we are gone, you guys will rail about how unfair it is that we went down.

That's because you guys don't sell stuff for "dirt cheap," which seems to be the no. 1 priority for purchasers in the digital age.

My priority is getting stuff for as cheap as possible, which generally means buying used (although when I was looking for something very specific and unavailable used, I did order a new Hamer from Elduave). Maybe I should feel ashamed about that, but I don't. And as far as I know, there's nothing stopping a mom & pop store from listing their inventory (particularly used) on eBay if they feel it would make financial sense to do so.

-Austin

[jwhitcomb3]

Nobody so far has stated that they prefer to buy from Mom and Pop stores like mine and Dave's.

When we are gone, you guys will rail about how unfair it is that we went down.

I said that I turn to ebay due to limited retail options where I live. I can buy all the Peavey and Squire stuff I need right downtown.

Has there ever been a time when businesses didn't have to adapt to changes in lifestyle and technology? It seems there are ways for the brick-and-mortar businesses to leverage their expertise with the new technologies. How about a service that receives instruments purchased on ebay, inspects them, cleans them, and sets them up for customers? A network of independent dealers that can rotate and exchange stock and cross-order? An instrument exchange network?