Curious about Gibson Pickups

[Ting Ho Dung]

Are all these Tings based on the PAF or do they have some hot pickups for the metal guys? I know they have the Burstbuckers and the 498t but those are kind of PAF. They had some OBLs in the 25/50 but those are secret. That's about the extent of my knowledge. I'm sorry this isn't Hamer related unless I wanted to put a set in one of the Hamer's I don't have. I don't feel like joining another asshole forum which I hear the LP forum is one. Just curious again why people are so anxious to swap out pickups. What did Tony Iommi do to get the metal tone with those old PAFs? Wasn't EVH's first pu a PAF? He's a pathological liar so maybe no one knows but I remember reading back around 1980 he dipped a PAF in Sex Wax and if he left it soak too long the pu would melt.

Dank,

Ting, Out.

[Sugartune]

What about the Gibson Dirty Fingers?

Check this out.

A rundown on what they have, with clips!

http://www.gibson.com/News-Lifestyle/Features/en-us/tone-hunting-0309-2011.aspx

[crunchee]

+1 on the Dirty Fingers. The Gibson 496R and 500T are plenty hawt too (they're on the list that Sugartune provided), they've got ceramic magnets, and were originally standard in the old LP Classic ('1960') model.

Edited to add: The 496R and 500T are also used on Gibson Explorer 'regular' (non-custom shop) models, too.

[murkat]

Mmmmmm.....

well, Seth Lover, a gibson emp., designed and built the first PAF while employed by Gibson.

The design was shelf'd for a bit until it became a marketing scheme in typical Gibson fashion (somethings never change).

BTW, all this info can be obtained by the interview of Seth with Seymour Duncan).

As the music landscape of tone changed in the seventies, the birth of "hotter pickups", Lawrence (obl), DiMarzio, Mighty Mite, etc.,

so did Gibson, the Dirty Fingers pup( market share ).

You have to take in account that back then, "we" did not have the amps we have now, and the thinking of was to

slam the front end of an AMP with a hot signal, a stronger out put pickup.

Since then, Gibson Hates others that dip in there market share, So, Gibson will always be two steps behind,

but will eventually come out with a pickup that is current flavor.

There are a plenty of Gibson pickups in many output flavors.

Bill Lawrence was also an employee of Gibson for many years as well. (OBL, and other names).

Changing pickups~ (guitars in general) a modern man's legos. Guitarist's love to mingle around with, see what makes the tick.

Tony Iommi / metal tone~ the infamous lil box as well used by masses (past, present, future).... treble booster.

EVH's first pup a PAF?~ He used plenty of different pups. the one he favored the most is the first gen mighty Mite as seen in many pics and vids.

[Ting Ho Dung]

Mmmmmm.....

well, Seth Lover, a gibson emp., designed and built the first PAF while employed by Gibson.

The design was shelf'd for a bit until it became a marketing scheme in typical Gibson fashion (somethings never change).

BTW, all this info can be obtained by the interview of Seth with Seymour Duncan).

As the music landscape of tone changed in the seventies, the birth of "hotter pickups", Lawrence (obl), DiMarzio, Mighty Mite, etc.,

so did Gibson, the Dirty Fingers pup( market share ).

You have to take in account that back then, "we" did not have the amps we have now, and the thinking of was to

slam the front end of an AMP with a hot signal, a stronger out put pickup.

Since then, Gibson Hates others that dip in there market share, So, Gibson will always be two steps behind,

but will eventually come out with a pickup that is current flavor.

There are a plenty of Gibson pickups in many output flavors.

Bill Lawrence was also an employee of Gibson for many years as well. (OBL, and other names).

Changing pickups~ (guitars in general) a modern man's legos. Guitarist's love to mingle around with, see what makes the tick.

Tony Iommi / metal tone~ the infamous lil box as well used by masses (past, present, future).... treble booster.

EVH's first pup a PAF?~ He used plenty of different pups. the one he favored the most is the first gen mighty Mite as seen in many pics and vids.

Lot's of good info. Thanks.

Do you know what the Mighty Mite was fashioned after? I'm not looking for the EVH tone myself but am curious whether it was after the PAF or if it was just a hot pu.

[tbonesullivan]

I will say that I always liked the sound I got from my SG Standard, which had the 490R 498T combination, which gibson calls the "modern classic". They are also the standard pickups in the Les Paul custom.

For the "hotter" crowd they made the 496R and 500T pickups with ceramic magnets. Those I think are/were standard equipment in the explorer and flying V.

[Disturber]

Lot's of good info. Thanks.

Do you know what the Mighty Mite was fashioned after? I'm not looking for the EVH tone myself but am curious whether it was after the PAF or if it was just a hot pu.

Not 100% sure but I think that the Mighty Mite pup VH used was a Superdistortion copy. The Mighty Mite 1300 Distortion.

That was the pickup I bought to replace a P90 in my first electric guitar, a Hondo. I sold it perhaps 10 years ago when I found it in an old box. It did not sound that good to me. Perhaps it needs Eddies fingers and amp set up to bloom.

Didn't Seymour Duncan wind pickups for Mighty Mite in the early days? I have read that somewhere.

[Ting Ho Dung]

I will say that I always liked the sound I got from my SG Standard, which had the 490R 498T combination, which gibson calls the "modern classic". They are also the standard pickups in the Les Paul custom.

For the "hotter" crowd they made the 496R and 500T pickups with ceramic magnets. Those I think are/were standard equipment in the explorer and flying V.

I had a Studio for a short time that had those pickups. I thought it sounded fine except for the general poor quality guitar.

[DaveL]

I have a 2014 flying V... the stock pickups are burstbucker pros (they usually add the 500-490T combo).

I had planned to rip em out (some forum guys hate them) but they sounded surprisingly good in an all

mahogany guitar. Smooth overdrive and backs off into a nice bluesy vibe.

Just found an explorer from the same year which has the same combo, (not here yet). Going to give that

a shot...

[Armitage]

I love the 490R 498T combination...

[anotherfreak]

I had the 490R/498T set in an SG, sounded good(I did buy the guitar) but I later dropped a set of Seth Lovers in it and it CAME ALIVE!!!

....I mean, not really ALIVE, per say, but I liked it much better with the Duncans in it.

[Armitage]

It's funny, I had Mighty Mite Distortions way back when and I didn't think much of them. When I saw Eddie fans saying he may have used them all I could think was these guys thought they were made of unobtanium and simply never played them.

I read once the Seymour wound MM but haven't read it since...

[Disturber]

I have a 2014 flying V... the stock pickups are burstbucker pros (they usually add the 500-490T combo).

I had planned to rip em out (some forum guys hate them) but they sounded surprisingly good in an all

mahogany guitar. Smooth overdrive and backs off into a nice bluesy vibe.

Just found an explorer from the same year which has the same combo, (not here yet). Going to give that

a shot...

I think Burstbuckers are killer sounding pickups. Like them much better than most of Seymour Duncans PAF versions. My band mates Les Paul Custom all mahogany TV Silver has Burstbuckers and that guitar is fuckin' incredible. Sounds just like a great LP should sound.

I put a very early Burstbucker, unpotted, in my Super Pro and it's the best bridge pup I've tried in that guitar so far. It made it sound like old wood. It's a great sounding, pretty raw, paf. Love the A2 sag and the rudeness of it. Can do a great Keith RIchards through a Deluxe Reverb, or classic LP 70's tones through my JMP. Articulate, but still rude. A great combo.

One thing I hate when people describe how a humbucker sounds are the words "clarity" and "note definition". Like they were describing a digital stereo system, or a pair of top of the shelve head phones. Words used by hifi nerds. I want my pickups dirty and raw, "clarity" up my ass. I don't play feckin' jazz.

[benjammin308]

The dirty fingers in my '83 explorer got pulled years ago. Some people love them but mine were muddy. I wouldn't think of touching the '57 Classics in my LP Elegant, they're perfect, but definitely PAF style.

[JGravelin]

Ting,

Gibsons baseline for tone as it applies to pickups has certainly evolved over the years, an equal part reflection of the musical/tonal tastes of the times and in keeping a mind for profit margins also, I'd say. Some of those late 50's lower output models and early 60's jobs are the defining sounds personaly IMHO - but also, there's a huge range of variation with those. Nothing from the Gibson line is tailored to the metal crowd specifically, but there's a pretty decent range of designs that can split the difference between what's considered "classic PAF" and "i'm throwing horns with both hands because it's so totally fukin metal" and appeal to a really wide variety of musician. I think Gibson makes some killer pickups! With the right woods, built properly, the right amp, and a somebody that knows how to really play that damn guitar...pure magic. The BB line = solid, good sounding pickups. Tastes are subjective and wood density fluctuates. Good for metal? Hmm. Depends on what era of metal you're speaking of. Tons of players use stock, unmolested Gibsons for a reason and it's because they do sound super if you get the right one! Sometimes the stock stuff sounds phenomenal.

Tony Iommi had great, early-issue, totally killer british amps, cranked them up, used gagits, and depending on what era of Black Sabbath you're into he may or may not have been using the stock models in his SG. John Birch built sets for him too as did John Diggins as mentioned in the Wiki.

I think EVH most likely used one of the PAFs out of his 335 and rewound only ONE of the coils but yeah - it's like talking about UFOs. No one will ever know for sure!

Rock and roll. I Believe.

[Armitage]

I love some Burstbuckers (2 and 3 rock!), but hate Burstbucker Pros...

[tbonesullivan]

The problem now is that they have so many damned different pickups, I can't tell what's what. Seems like every model now has different pickups. Back in the "good old days" they just had ONE PAF. THat of course varied all over the place.

It's good to catch up with the rest of the industry, but seymour duncan and dimarzio have great writeups, graphics, etc that help you decide how a pickup will perform. With Gibson, you never know what you're gonna get.

[it's me HHB]

The early Sabbath were P 90

[crunchee]

The problem now is that they have so many damned different pickups, I can't tell what's what. Seems like every model now has different pickups. Back in the "good old days" they just had ONE PAF. THat of course varied all over the place.

I saw this listing today (no affiliation), and it reminded me of another original 1959 LP that somebody posted about here at the HFC, at least a year ago. BOTH had original, untouched PAFs, where the neck pickup DC resistance was significantly HIGHER than the DC resistance for the bridge pickup...which is the opposite of modern-day conventional wisdom, if one looks at a typical HB pickup neck and bridge set. Edited to add: Yes, I realize that pickup winding, selection, and installation was random back then, it kinda all depended on what was pulled out of the pickup bin at the time...the 'luck of the draw', literally. Anyway, there's lots of variables at work going on with pickups besides DC resistance, I understand very little of what makes a pickup a pickup, but perhaps Josh and/or Murkat can weigh in about what effect that random pickup configuration would do to the guitar's sound and output:

https://www.gbase.com/gear/gibson-les-paul-standard-1959-suburst

[JGravelin]

A '59 LP! Nice. I have experience with a few late 50's/early 60's Gibson and Epiphones with the lower resistance pickup in the bridge - happy mistake or by design, who knows, but they do sound great like that. The lower resistance pickup on it's own will sound brighter/clearer and when combined with the pickup with the higher resistance value, the way in which each pickups frequency response intermingles with the other is where you notice the difference. On the guitars I've heard like this, it adds a certain bite and vibrancy to the switched middle position. I loved it for clean chordal playing and stinging blues leads. I'd imagine it'd be great for slide too.

[HELShane]

I love the 490R 498T combination...

ugh........

[tbonesullivan]

I love the 490R 498T combination...

ugh........

I liked it as well. Depends on what your tastes are.